I’m surprised this isn’t a bigger story, though perhaps it hasn’t yet migrated from England to the US. The vice-chairman of Goldman Sachs International, Lord Griffiths (and doesn’t it just fit that he’s a lord), said yesterday in London at conference on “morality and markets” (!) that the public most learn to tolerate inequality as the price to be paid for prosperity, a stunning quote given recent events in the global financial markets.
In remarks that will fuel the row around excessive pay, Lord Griffiths, vice-chairman of Goldman Sachs International and a former adviser to Margaret Thatcher, said banks should not be ashamed of rewarding their staff.
Speaking to an audience at St Paul’s Cathedral in London about morality in the marketplace last night, Griffiths said the British public should “tolerate the inequality as a way to achieve greater prosperity for all” [...]
With public anger mounting at the forecast of bumper bonuses for bankers only a year after the industry was rescued by the taxpayer, he said bankers’ bonuses should be seen as part of a longer-term investment in Britain’s economy. “I believe that we should be thinking about the medium-term common good, not the short-term common good … We should not, therefore, be ashamed of offering compensation in an internationally competitive market which ensures the bank businesses here and employs British people,” he said.
Griffiths said that many banks would relocate abroad if the government cracked down on bonus culture. “If we said we’re not going to have as big bonuses or the same bonuses as last year, I think then you’d find that lots of City firms could easily hive off their operations to Switzerland or the far east,” he said.
He’s certainly got the “Lord” thing down, right?
We hear this sentiment in America as well, that bankers must be paid outrageous bonuses to stay competitive globally, or bankers will simply move operations to… well, London, for starters. Clearly there’s always another country that corporations will use as a bargaining chip to maintain the status quo.
I can’t speak for Britain, but here in America we have been tolerating the inequality for quite a while. In America, the richest 1% hold more wealth than the bottom 90% combined and are making the largest share of national income since right before the stock market crash in 1928. Executives receive one-third of all compensation in the US. Over the last five years, executives received a 48% increase while wages for everyone else were flat. The gap between the rich and the poor tripled between 1979 and 2006. And this trend has continued even during the current recession.
And what did the overwhelming mass of Americans get for their toleration of this inequality, which has spiked since the Reagan era? The biggest financial crisis since the Depression, the cusp of double-digit unemployment, a spate of recessions with jobless recoveries, and essentially a different America for the super-rich relative to everyone else.
MSNBC anchor Dylan Ratigan went off about this quote this morning, recommending that his viewers take their money out of the biggest banks and paying in cash instead of credit cards. This was also prompted by Bank of America and Citigroup raising fees on the fiscally responsible who pay off their credit card balances every month, and the Chamber of Commerce’s $37 million dollars in lobbying. It was a righteous rant:
Visit msnbc.com for Breaking News, World News, and News about the Economy
So far, he’s the only media figure in the US I’ve seen discussing this amazing quote. Maybe that’s coming.
…Think Progress has more.





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Oh and it would be such the fucking tragedy if these bastards based their thieving in another country. What a dreadful loss to the national fabric to have fewer bankers and hedgies. As if the country would lose rather than gain prosperity without them? These guys must all have a BS in bullshit.
Thank you for those statistics. Everyone in America should hear them. It’s so stark when put that way: 1% have more than 90% combined. Sometimes, I’m not sure we’re all members of the same species when I take these things in. How can live with themselves?
I think I’m starting to hate the rich. I never liked and repected them and never aspired to be them, but now I may outright hate them.
They wrote the book, didn’t they? And they’re getting away with it right and left. Here are a few more examples involving the three piggies: Timmie, Hankie and Bennie.
“During last year’s transition period between presidential regimes, Obama economic aides Timothy Geithner and Larry Summers signed off on the Bush administration’s deal to bail out Bank of America if it finalized its merger with ailing investment bank Merrill Lynch, according to bank documents obtained Tuesday by ABC News.” (They’re denying this account, apparently.)
The secret Paulson-Goldman meeting “This is sleazy in the extreme, and will only serve to heighten suspicions that Paulson’s Treasury was rigging the game in favor of Goldman all along.”
Bernanke Airs Concern on Speeding Up Credit-Card Law (Update2)
He’s concerned that the credit card issuers won’t have enough time to make an “orderly transition.” Try that one the next time your credit card company abruptly raises its rates.
Thanks so much for highlighting the message from the pompous Lord Grifter, David. Not only is the News Desk a wonderful idea, but I continue to be mightily impressed with what you are doing with it. Kudos and then some.
Shorter Lord Griffiths, “Let them eat cake”.
Holy cow! Is Obama getting serious about pay cuts at bailed out firms? Surely this is just more smoke:
There also is a Reuters story with the same info.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20091021/bs_nm/us_financial_regulation_payczar
Ah, Jim White, but do read the fine print, er last paragraph : “Notably, some of the most high-profile recipients of government aid, such as investment bank Goldman Sachs, are not on the list.”
Noblesse oblige–short on oblige–long on Noblesse.
Kind of interesting that he delivered the speech in St. Paul’s Cathedral.
There’s nothing wrong with people getting rich, and therefore nothing wrong with inequality if their riches were gained honestly and by doing something for it.
Making money on the backs of others, on other peoples money, and at the expense of others lives and treasure should be a crime. These Wall Street fools make their money off of using people and businesses, for their personal gain, whether legal or illegal, and manipulations of what seems like normal business to work for them.
Those who have paid back their TARP funds aren’t subject to further restrictions.
Oh. Thanks so much for the explanation, Jim White. Wish somebody would get “claw back” enacted, dammit.
If I’m not mistaken, this is the same Lord who was on Glenn Beck’s show yesterday talking down about everyone but the pasty white rich people! Seriously. I’m even more furious today reading this post and what this man said knowing he was on Hatemonger Beck’s show yesterday!
Yep. that’s what i was gonna say.
There’s always going to be inequality, people who have more and people who have less than I do. But when the top 1% get there by ripping off those who have less than they do, well, I gotta little problem with that.
With whose money?
Lie back and think of Goldmans.
Funny Keynes another Englishman and the guy who got us out of the Great Depression seems to disagree with this Hack who with his firm caused the worst failure since the Great Depression.
This is great. It will be a real popular move.
Everyone hates these wall st. criminals. Such arrogance…
I understand why Lord Griffiths said it. A murderer has excuses, too. A government official caught stealing has them. A public figure caught in the pants of a little girl or boy always argues that he was protecting the child, not abusing them. Why would anyone buy it?
We should tolerate government sponsored inequality because it leads to prosperity? For Lord Griffiths, certainly. For the government and media figures he buys, certainly. For anyone else?
Tears trickle down. I’ve seen that. Sweat, too. And shit. Jobs, prosperity, promises of local investment and tax revenue? They defy economic gravity; they or their benefits always float up, unless firmly tied down.
Wowie wow. Apparently His Lordship hasn’t grokked that we Amuricans know all about the sham that is trickle down.
And, given how pissed the Brits are these days about the “expenses” scandal with their MPs, I think they are none too eager for much toleration of inequality.
That’s funny. Nice historical ref.
Fuck these bankzilla traitors.
Should we let them go??
We should kick them out!
Suck up the inequality, and enjoy it peasants! Goldman Sachs is so kind giving crumbs to those unappreciative low net worth individuals.
The Phony Paulson Bailout Swindle is finally getting some attention from the Villagers. Those watch puppies at CREW have discovered that Henry Paulson has some, what do you call them? “Conflicts of interest”, secret meetings, and more telephone calls than teenagers. Paulson’s biggest problem was that he needed more GS people in the Treasury Dept. to carry away all the loot.
I am glad that Melanie Sloan and CREW are finally taking my advice and are going after corporate criminals. I would next suggest “Complaints” against the government officials such as Zelikow, Feith, Wolfowitz and all the Cheney’s who lied about the Iraq War. But it is certainly shocking that Hank was palin’ around with his old GS buddies, with more than a little inside information. Melanie does know the difference between government and social, she is a Villager.
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2009/10/hank-paulson-goldman-sachs-secret-meeting
That was my first thought as well. With fewer banks and banksters we should be able to reconstruct our manufacturing base without foreign investment. Keynes was all for stimulating the economy with the creation of jobs. Do we need jobs? Duh. The banksters can move to the Near and Far East and trade their sow’s ears amongst themselves over there.
Ian Welsh linked up a comment from the agonist earlier this week… which really sums up what Goldmans is doing now.
Wouldn’t it be cool if Dylan Ratigan’s suggestion that we move from large banks to community banks or credit unions took place across the globe?
Well Lord Upper Class Twit of the Year, no doubt, pines and longs for the days of feudal serfdom, where he could be the Lowered & Master of all he surveyed and rip off his peasants with abandon. No doubt he also pines for droit du seigneur, as well.
They just can’t quit trickle down, can they? No matter how obvious it is that it’s not working, these self-entitled mega-rich creeps just think they can keep squeezing blood out of a stone. How rich do they have to be to have be enough? There never will be enough for them, so someone else will have to set some limits via regulations and taxes (I can dream, can’t I??).
These threats about how all the richie-riches are the only ones who run things well are b.s. Same with all the threats to pack up their tea cups and head out of dodge to the next whiskey bar where they can rip off someone else.
Lord Mucky Muck might fool some, but not all. Please come back when you can at least be honest about who and what you are: a parasite!
It’s not as if they are contributing much in the way of capital to the economy now. Just higher fees.
Jim Cramer of CNBC is just like Lord Griffiths:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRa0B34jMOQ
Cramer and his buddies use the backs of American’s retirement funds to steal! Spit.
Everyone do yourselves a favor and visit the Guardian site covering this story. Note the comments section, which echoes the sentiments here. And loudly and probably profanely, too, as many have been removed by the moderator.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/oct/21/executive-pay-bonuses-goldmansachs
annual salaries are cut, but they still get bonuses in restricted stock.
Lord Haha’s spiel is part of a campaign to keep the British government from tightening compensation for bankers. Where exactly are the banks going to relocate to? The short term inequality is total BS. In this country, wages for workers went flat 30 years ago. But it is most important to understand that the big profits that banks have been making don’t represent wealth creation. They are money skimmed off the top in the stock market or in the dark pools. They are profits from speculation made by jacking up prices on commodities like oil so that even with worldwide recession and an oil glut, prices are more than double what they should be, given the conditions. They are also the fees and charges that banks are hitting customers with. If you look at the price/earnings ratios for most companies they are in the stratosphere. The stock market is a big bubble. There is no there to it. Volumes have been thin. Late in the day big price moves common. It is a Potemkin market, a sucker’s market. This is what this dipshit lord is trying to sell us as caviar.
Excellent observation. Lord Griffiths isn’t an advocate for prosperity; he’s an advocate for his right to skim the profits from it and keep it himself.
Yep, I’ve grown to pretty much distrust them.
The saddest thing of all though, is these 1% rich fuckers somehow bamboozle enough of the 90% fighting for crumbs into voting against their own self interests, and to hate each other, rather than the fucking hoarders at the top.
It’s those that allow themselves to be manipulated and bamboozled and hold their hands over ears shouting LALALALA when you try to tell it to them straight that I truly hate. I’ve got some fucking deap-seated hatred for those assholes. They even appear here once in awhile, defending a party and system that fucks them in every position and at every opportunity it can.
I’m afraid I have no tolerance for intolerance, and very little for stupidity.
Damn those 3 million Americans that have all this wealth!!! How did these people make this wealth??? Those bastards started businesses and created millions of jobs in the process!!!! bastards!!!! These 3 million people remain there because they innovate or are removed because others have. The only difference now is that they are being kicked off the “world” list by people and companies from other countries. Yes there are rich arrogant bastards that do very little good but this top 1% also pays like 25% of all the federal income taxes!! These people have figured out that those that bitch and whine about the “system” screwing them over all the time are gonna continue to be screwed over. They see that the system is here how about we accept it and use it to our advantage and they suceed and prosper!!
Off the top of my head I don’t see why we couldn’t recapitalize commercial banks to make up for whatever assets they’re holding from the likes of GS and can’t dump. It would also provide an opportunity to align our monetary policy with reality.
DDay, I just wanted to add that your news gathering is a great new feature for this site. Perhaps… the beginning of some new glory days for what we once called journalism.
And right on fucking cue.
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That’s not something I know much about, but it sounds reasonable.
Surely, banks that are too big to fail (at least in the past) could be allowed to float away into the ethers.
I agree – tolerate the inequality.
Higher income, leaping higher taxes! Get more, get taxed MORE! YES!
Goldman Saks made what???? $3.18 billion in this quarter!! I think if they earned the money they are entitled to give it to whomever they want. Their employees that earned it sure sounds nice to me sorta what the unions have been crying for for 50 years right. They give more to charity, sure to make their image better but it is still a good cause right. Stop whineing and get yours!! Goldman was and is a strong company they where forced to take the TARP money and paid it back with interest soon as they were allowed
Not my area of expertise but I’m workin’ on it. *g* Never cared much for economics but have had to teach myself just to stay on top of all this shit.
Then we have Lord Haha (good, Hugh) and his pea brained supporter here.
In recent years, I’ve realized DiFi thinks she’s the Duchess of California, so I guess it all fits.
Gotta go listen to my Dodgers try to stay alive.
Namaste
sure I’m a rare person, more so on this site but really. I’m early twenties, left college without a degree to start out on a path that I felt had the most opportunity for me. I don’t believe in debt. I have 16 year old car that needs a new clutch but also have 2 duplexes bought by working 12 hours a day 7 days a week and spending nothing when it was available. I make my life uncomfortable now so that when I get into my 40′s and 50′s I can afford $1500/m healthcare if that is what is necessary. I think people that earn money should actually be able to keep a decent amount of it. Whether they earn money on their own or a company deems that they are worth a certain amount. I don’t think finding a way to succeed should be punished with higher taxes and the hatred of ill-tempered bloggers. I do think the well-off should give back but I also see charity and other donation means much more helpful and efficient than Government programs….. sorry
Ignorance is indeed bliss.
Same here bro, my mom is a Dodger fan from when they were in Brooklyn, and while I was around when they moved to LA, I didn’t really get into baseball until later.
Now I’m just pulling for the Dodgers just for her. She lost her husband this year after a long struggle with severe dementia, and she showed me strength I never knew the woman had. Man I’d like nothing better than to see her beloved Dodgers win once more before it’s her time.
Actually, Lord Griffiths is invoking standard Ayn Rand boilerplate. The idea that we should all get out of the way of a few select “uber-menschen” whose towering mental abilities shower all of us peasants with golden goodness.
Greenspan is a big adherent of this crap. Indeed most of the elite justify their privileged positions with Ayn Randian BS.
Does anybody else feel like we are living in a Dickens novel?
Tale of Two Cities I hope. Guillotine anyone. What was that Whop!!?
You stupid fuck! Every motherfucker that works in this country adds to economic wealth because they make a product and sell a product and then buys a product. Thats is how economies work you dildo. When you add more product, you add more jobs. When you add more jobs, more people make money…Is this making sense you wall street dumb fucks. When you keep my money to gamble, I dont give a fuck if you win or lose because guess why? Because I lose either way!!!!!!!
Im getting my doctorate in economics running for office and cleaning fucking house. If that doesnt work, I’ll organize and protest. Either way, we have to wake up…..If these people have no money they cannot do this shit. I cannot decide where my taxes go but sure as hell can decide where my net income goes.
I would love to be left alone in a room with that old bag.
We had a lending institution in the military called the “Slush Fund”(guys with extra cash) with better rates than this Banking Failure. I call it legalized extortion.
Where are they going to go? These bankers are genuine pariahs in every developed country and most of the rest of the world. Maybe they could go to Somalia with the rest of the pirates.
You’ve got lots to learn in the school of hard knox my dear.
How about Warren Buffet? He’s used his own brains and hard work to make a few bucks, wouldn’t you say? But he is patriotic enough, he is civic-minded enough, he is sharp enough to see that vast wealth must shoulder a fair share of the burden of maintaining an enlightened civilized society. He testified to exactly this before Congress. (Sorry, I’m no good at links.)
My resume is not much different from yours. Worked hard, saved money, invested in real estate, got ahead. I don’t love paying taxes but I certainly appreciate that my taxes provide a fire dept. if my houses catch on fire, that they pay for the police if someone’s breaking in. That they pay for a Nat’l weather Service so I can prepare my rentals for a bad storm. And I would pay more taxes to provide myself and my countrymen with a reliable, humane health system. One that works to maintain a healthy country. And protects me from being swindled out of all I have worked for by a rapacious health insurance company that doesn’t live up to the terms of the policy. You are young and I admire your initiative, but keep your intellect limber. Your country is not just a place for “the fittest to survive.” Your country is a team and its gov’t has a role to play. I could say more but I will simply suggest you take a closer look at WWII and see what this country can do when it pulls together and looks past the “me 1st” mentality. Godspeed
Your work ethic is commendable. Never forget to save. And for the love of Pete, please go back to college and take economics.
I gotta tell yah, if socialism is the alternative….its looking better and better! Im not that foolish though. Shouldnt let a couple bad apples spoil the bunch.
“Goldman Saks made what???? $3.18 billion in this quarter!! I think if they earned the money they are entitled to give it to whomever they want.”
No one’s telling them they can’t. Goldman Sachs (note actual spelling) paid back their TARP loan. Your hysterics are unwarranted.
This AM Dylan Ratigan claimed that Goldman Sachs has paid back only “10 billion of the 50 billion” it received. What’s accurate here, does anybody really know?
Let them go abroad. Who gives a shit besides landlords in Manhattan? This is the same kind of stuff that screwed the British economy in the 1920s.
Right on brother.
Most of those guy’s made their money on your money but you can’t see it. While you paid your taxes, they avoided theirs with the loop holes their high priced lawyers and accountents found for them. Some of the richest bought out those companies that used to make jobs, sold them out for profit, closing business and jobs. Yet we look up to them as smart business men but they really just rich crooks.
Born and raised in DeeCee I was stuck with the Senators and hated the Yankees. Started following the Dodgers on da radio early on but got to see some great players come through Griffith Stadium in the 50s.
Oh, yes. Pity those poor upper 1% wage earners their tax burden, indeed.
But, about that share of after tax income …
Hmmm. That might suggest their tax burden is no burden at all, eh?
The repayment of TARP funds was all kabuki. It was the other government credit lines, exemptions, and the implied government backstop that they have been living large on. GS and MS both need to be cut off. They also need to be investigated for all kinds of fraud and illegal trading activities in which they have been involved.
Guy,
No one is going to begrudge you the results of your labor. The difference between you and Goldman’s is they do not make honest money. Their money is made by manipulating the markets, the government and the laws. If you were selling dope to get your duplexes, we’d probably have a problem with that, because it is blood money. So too is Goldman’s. Just take into consideration the number of people who have had their retirement plans delayed because of the high risks Goldman and other marketeers were taking that collapsed the market last year. Wouldn’t you be a little pissed also?
What we want is an honest and level playing field, where each has the opportunity to gain as much as he/she is willing to put into it. Right now, that is not the case, and the burden of their foolish quests is being passed onto every American.
This is aside from them buying legislation that increases their wealth at the expense of working class peoples. A whole nother episode. ;)
no haters here.
Thanks for covering this item!!
I think that this Lord is the very guy that I saw interviewed (on video) at the Financial Times in a clip yesterday. I honestly almost emailed them to inquire who did the spoof; then I realized that it was almost certainly ‘real’. (Or maybe it was another Lord-like type, a UK bankster saying it was all quite pleasant to be in a business where you get to take a cut of the government giving you money that you then lend out at interest — quite the toff, he wuz. Bet his wife has lovely posh frocks and a full calendar of charity auction dates.)
I’m pleased that technologies like online video and the Internet are making it possible for more people to get glimpses of these attitudes.
The insolence is so authentic it’s comedic, assuming you prefer your comedy inky black.
But look at the bright side: could there possibly be a dumber thing to say, even in private, at a time like this? Marie Antoinette’s cake gag (mentioned above) comes close, but hardly surpasses it. Lord Ha Ha’s timing is even better than that of the geniuses that gave us the transparently bogus AHIP report a few days back–perfect for pouring gasoline on the barely smoldering fire of public opinion. The politicians and lobbyists that are paid to do His Lordship’s talking for him are no doubt tearing their hair and clawing for the Pepto.
I think you missed my point, which was not that GS are saints, but that the trolls around here (“sad4america”) need to do a little more research before getting their panties bunched up.
Why is it that conservatives seem to think that all liberals are lazy slackers somehow sucking off the system? Everyone I know works hard and frankly contributes just as much to our economy (or more) as any conservative does; many of my liberal pals are business owners who employ others. This meme that these uber wealthy conservatives are all such hard, hard workers who are being ripped off by us neer-do-well liberals, dirty messicans, cadillac welfare AA, etc, is really top of the line b.s.
I’ve worked 2 jobs most of my life, and I’m close to 60. I’ve saved a lot and watched a lot of it get ripped off by jugglers & clowns like Mr. Little Lord Fauntleroy here, and I certainly don’t appreciate his aggravating disdain and arrogance. I’m also like: well, yeah, Lord Hoo-Hah, you just go move along to… ??? good luck with that. No one likes you anyway.
To imply that this ginned up “better” somehow shouldn’t pay his fair share in taxes bc he “works so hard” and “creates jobs” is just stupid.
It’s quite something else how successful the 1% have been in getting a big portion of the population to vote and act against their own interests, while demonizing those of us who highlight the reality of what’s really happening.
This here recession: like, it’s not bc of my slackerdom. It’s bc of greedheads like Lord HaHa here, who gambled and played around with my money and lost my money (but not his money). And frankly, this aristocratic sack of shite could care less about anyone not in the 1% club, including dumb conservative serfs who support his b.s. He’s not gonna toss any of us – conservative or liberal – any more bones or crumbs than he absolutely has to, no matter how much we might try to suck up to him. Sheesh.
To quote Johnny Rotten, another Brit, at the last Sex Pistols show at the Winterland in San Francisco in 1979:
Finance has a competitive advantage which sucks capital away from objectively productive pursuits because it offers 30:1 returns on investment compared to maybe 8% on a real investment. Government’s role is to ensure that dangerous disparities in power between competing constituencies are reconciled in a way that benefits the most.
This happens often in land use, where more profitable land uses are restricted in order to create space for less profitable, but economically essential uses. In gentrifying areas, luxury housing often crowds out job producing light industrial uses because housing generates hundreds of dollars per square foot while production generates tens per sq/ft.
At the end of the day, the costs of finance arguably outweigh the fleeting “prosperity.” But so long as the profits generated by finance are sufficient to both crowd out production as well as purchase elections, these people will ride the economy down the tubes like Slim Pickens rode the H Bomb in “Dr. Strangelove.”
I had drinks last night with a friend of mine who works at Citibank. You will be happy to hear that employees are not getting bonuses. They are, however, gettting “retroactive raises,” which are completely different. Your tax dollars at work.