FDL Action is calling progressive House members to see if they’ll still hold to their written vow not to vote for a health care bill without a public option. You can see the real-time results of the call reports here.
The strategy for Nancy Pelosi appears to be to allow as many progressives as possible to vote against the final bill, hoping to pick up some Blue Dogs and more conservative Democrats with the framework of the Senate bill. So how is that process unfolding?
So far, we don’t know much. TPM is tracking the 39 House Democrats who voted against the health care bill the first time around. Of those, Bobby Bright (D-AL) has already stated that he’s still a no. The final bill will be less progressive-friendly than the bill which originally passed the House, so the two members who claimed to have voted against the House bill because it didn’t go far enough, Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) and Eric Massa (D-NY), can be reasonably expected to vote no again. And Mike McIntyre (D-NC) actually spoke at the “prayercast” put on by right-wingers to stop the health care bill, so I think we can put him down as a no as well.
So that’s four definite no’s. What about everyone else?
The reason I think most Blue Dogs in conservative districts will stay with their no votes is that they face the same basic political pressures. Dan Boren (D-OK) is a good example. This article describes him “fighting to keep his seat” in Congress by voting against practically every item in the Democratic agenda. Flipping on the health care bill at this stage would be completely out of character. Here’s another example of a Democratic Blue Dog and his Republican challenger sniping over how much they hate the health care bill:
(Republican challenger Josh) First also took aim at what he called a lack of leadership on Holden’s part. Although Holden voted against the House health care reform bill, First said Holden did not do enough to influence others to defeat the bill, such as hold town hall meetings.
The “no” vote was ultimately inconsequential, First said, because the bill had enough support to pass and his vote was not needed.
“It was election-year conversion. It was symbolic. It was meant to hoodwink the constituents in his district,” First said. “Tim Holden is a phony.”
Holden took issue with the accusation of political calculation, and pointed to an interview with Times-Shamrock Newspapers two days before the health care vote in which he announced his intention to vote against the legislation.
“If it was so inconsequential, why was the AFL-CIO just picketing me on Monday of this week for my vote against it?” Holden said, referring to a demonstration at his Pottsville office calling for him to rethink his health care vote.
Can anyone see Holden changing his vote at this stage?
This is not to say that no Blue Dogs will flip. Jason Altmire (D-PA) is openly talking about looking at that possibility, and Jim Matheson (D-UT) is talking up the Senate’s excise tax.
Still, while lots of House Blue Dogs say they’re keeping an open mind on the final vote, nothing has changed on the political landscape where the same people continually worried about challenges from their right and habitually unwilling to take stands on Democratic priorities and principles would suddenly change their worldviews. I would be surprised if more than a handful changed their vote. Which means that Speaker Pelosi will have a difficult job getting to 218, no matter what comes out of the conference committee.
UPDATE: John Boccieri (D-OH) looks like a no as well, given his comments at a meeting with constituents in his district.
That’s 5 no votes.




53 Comments

Support this site!
Subscribe to the newsletter
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About FDL News Desk
Why won’t the CPC whip no votes? They made a pledge, and one Co-Chair, Woolsey, won’t even come out strongly as a no at this point.
because at the end of the day the only thing that matters are the lobbyists threatening to support someone else and the patronage flowing into their accounts
It’s fixed. It will just pass the house by a few votes.
Slaughter’s on record against the senate bill.
I thought TPM was in favor of the bill now.
Is this pearl-clutching counting?
Because they never really intended to vote no on the final bill, because liberals in Congress fold at the first sign of trouble. I think Rahm was right when he feared no trouble from the left, if he was talking about members of Congress. The problem might come if some of these folks get primaried from the left, which I am all for at this point. I think we overstate the ideology of “centrist” senators like Lieberman and Nelson, all they want is to feel like they are in the middle of the spectrum and the best way to do that is to say no to anything liberal, so just start at a point that is WAY more liberal and work towards bills that aren’t plain awful.
Oh, I meant to link to Slaughter’s cnn piece.
It’s hard for me to see many (if any) of them switching sides. Presumably, a big reason most of them voted against it the first time around is because they were afraid the GOP was going to beat them over the head with it when election season rolls around. It’s going to be much, much easier to beat people over the head with the current version of the bill–if there’s anything scarier than “libruls are going to take all your money and give it to the govmint”, it would have to be “libruls are going to take all your money and give it to Blue Cross”.
TPM is absolutely for the bill. I’m pretty certain Josh Marshall gets his talking points sent over from Rahm’s office every morning.
There are good guys in the CPC. They need to get to work.
FDL took a lot of heat for coming out strong against Sen. Sanders for supporting the final Senate bill. You know I think we all like Sanders and we all like that he is the most liberal Senator, but this isn’t necessarily about who you like or don’t, it’s about getting results and its about policy. Screw this worshiping of different pols, I want real actual results. I see that Dkos has another senator-congressman-important person diary, with no limit of people to praise them for their strong words and “right-on.” Fuck that. There are real consequences to compromising so easily. The left is afraid that they dont want to be the group that blew up the deal, I would rather be against this thing then for it, and I think this being touted as a “liberal” bill could be about the worst thing that could happen to the left since President Reagan.
Hey Kids, we can learn from the French! When their politicians stop being responsive they strike!
Let’s all conduct zero financial transactions on Sunday January 17 as a demonstration of resolve to have real reform. No internet, no in-person spending on one Sunday.
If we can only demonstrate the same resolve as a surrender-monkey we might actually have some impact on the debate. It will add a reason to watch the State of the Union too.
Yes. Right now the CPC is operating as business as usual. IMO, this is the time to keep progressive pressure on the CPC to fulfill its pledge to block the vote.
Unfortunately, and as usual, Establishment D’s are caving. Progressives who switch votes because there is a divide in opinion on the left get some cover. This happens during every fight, and it has got to change.
I’m not so sure. Remember, they’re all up for re-election in 10 months. The GOP did a good job demonizing this bill when there wasn’t much to demonize. At this point, both liberals and libertarians are complaining that it forces people to buy shitty insurance. If the GOP can run with that talking point, then there’s no way this bill passes the House.
Nobody who feels that way qualifies as “left.” People supporting this bill are aligned with Obama, Reid, Lieberman, and all the other kleptocrats. That’s about as far from the left as you can get.
You are correct, of course. My 13 should say “perceived left” because they are nothing but corporatists.
The only thing we know for sure is that the bill is worse than nothing. It will pass IMO
There is no doubt that it will pass, most likely with a mandate. Progressives lose, as usual.
“If it was so inconsequential, why was the AFL-CIO just picketing me on Monday of this week for my vote against it?”
So criticism from the left can be helpful to conservative democrats? you don’t say..
Yeah I agree. Pelosi has a grind in front of her.
Exactly, how stupid does congress have to be not to realize this. It goes to show how far money can go to remove someone from reality.
The immense, unrelenting pressure being brought on these ‘lawmakers’n-breakers’ is a good thing.
Thank you Jane. Thank you pups.
Hope everyone is writing down the screen names of all those posting in support of this trash. Because they OWN it too.
Remember that folks, five or seven years from now. Remember it well. And oh, I’m OldFatGuy, and I’ll gladly buy a web cam and eat my hat five or seven years from now online live (if I’m breathing) if I’m wrong.
Not too worried about buying a web cam though.
This bill is NOT health care. It doesn’t provide anyone with HEALTH CARE, it provides some with health INSURANCE. Wanna take a guesstimate as to how many millions of families in the last decade alone WITH HEALTH INSURANCE became financially ruined?
This is poor policy, paid for regressively, and includes a mandate to be a customer of an industry WITH A AN ANTI-TRUST EXEMPTION. Soak that in. Forced to be a customer of an industry that can, in theory, legally price fix.
Make all who support it OWN it.
What can I personally do to help any one of them see what a disaster this will be? I’ve contacted offices just to be treated like a crazy person who doesn’t understand historic achievement when I see it or get form letters thanking me for understanding what amazing representatives they are and all they are doing for Americans (other than reading their actual letters, apparently). Polls seem to mean nothing to them. I feel so helpless and it’s horrible to feel that way about something so important. It’s not just the health care bill itself, but the way I see this affecting all of the other huge problems we have to deal with. If we don’t get our deficit under control and our financial system under control, what kind of country are we going to be living in? Yet, we can’t even raise taxes on the billionaires, which should be a no brainer in a democratic society? They actually see more political safety in middle class benefit and penalty taxes than in billionaire taxes and that scares me shitless about what our system is all about and where we are heading on all of the big issues we have to deal with.
Characterizing Boren’s voting with the Rs as “fighting to keep his seat” is laughable. Boren is a dyed-in-the-wool blue dog from a dynastic political family and he won his district with 70% of the vote in 2008. Of course he won’t vote with the party, he rarely does.
The Daily Oklahoman (or, as we call it, Daily Disappointment) article says he will be running again rather than retiring – the Corp media concept of “fighting to keep his seat.” It also goes on to say that he may or may not get any meaningful competition:
And how nice. Administration folks finally officially noticed that hovering cheenienit and picked up a fly-swatter.
Blue Texan’s regularly scheduled post is now available: “Victor Davis Hanson: Gen. Petraeus Not Taking Terrorism Seriously”
Sorry Teddy. Just noticed your fine diary.
Scott Murphy in NY-20th is touting his No vote the first time around but it is not clear from the comments if he will stick to that the second time around: http://www.saratogian.com/articles/2009/12/23/opinion/doc4b3115a010d42220533059.txt
They have screwed the bill up so badly that a lot are going to vote against it. They know they have to give a real PO on this or they lose their jobs.
Right, because if someone doesn’t agree with you on every issue, they must be your enemy.
I asked Massa if he’d vote against it on Kos. He wouldn’t commit either way.
I doubt it, but do gotta admit it’s a little comical.
I mean, the whole time the Democrats were negotiating with themselves. And if the negotiations were earnest (which I now doubt, but I’ll play along), it’s kinda funny in a way.
I mean, the two or three conservadems who probably really didn’t want a bill at all kept on adding such bullshit probably in the hopes of getting the others to say ENOUGH, OK, we won’t pass a damn bill. Instead they kept saying OK YEAH. So they’d add some more shit, and they kept saying OK YEAH.
lol, probably by the time they “finished” they actually liked the bill. Why not? It’s a conservative’s wet dream, supporting your corporate masters while technically not turning health care over the big bad gubmint.
None of that surprises me nearly as much as hearing and reading those that call themselves “liberal” or “progressive” now out in full support of it to the point of villifying those few of us against it.
OK, they OWN it. The mandate is THEIR’s. The continued medical bankruptcies is THEIR’s. The next industry that convinces the federal government to institute a mandate, the fault is THEIR’s. They own it and should wear it proudly.
So if we have “progressives” and Democrats in congress that tow the (Rahm/blue dog/conservative/center) line and keep losing to the right, why have them at all? Wouldn’t it be more meaningful to start a new party and elect independent progressives this November? Sure, they won’t have much power at first, but the Democratic majority isn’t delivering either. A third or multiparty system might instill enough fear in everybody to act straight. Right now the Dems are as corrupt by the corps if not more than Republicans. Did you see the video of Baucus drunk on the Sentae floor? that’s the guy in charge of a powerful committee in congress. You tube it.
TPM reports that a few to “a lot” of Blue Dogs may actually vote for the final bill if it hews to the Senate version.
We need to let Grijalva and Woolsey know right now that if they don’t vote against this garbage they can kiss their asses goodbye.
Keith Ellison seems like he might be a “no” vote if there’s no PO in it; I wrote him an email last week and told him I will strongly remember and support him even from Virginia if he votes no on the shitty bill.
We need to do whatever possible to make sure this bill doesn’t pass…barring some miracle of conference where we get all the stuff we want.
That report really has nothing in it that I didn’t already cite here. Lots of people saying “maybe” without being definitive.
Paraphrasing Rummy: You get screwed by the pols you’ve elected and not those you wish you had elected.
It’s a done deal, this bill will pass, and good riddance to that because we have a monster depression lurking around the Q2, that nearly no one seems to be paying attention to!
Yes, I saw an interview with Woolsey and she came off as wishy washy…she has a great voting record in congress, especially on the war and other social issues, but as co-chair of CPC, she needs to be much more assertive and forthright. Our side needs to know that you cannot negotiate from weakness. They gave up single payer and PO and a lot more way too easy. They should have objected early and often and then Nelson and Lieberman would have been the rightful villains in history. you replace two bad guys with two good ones or kill the fillibuster (or reconciliation) and you have a good bill. We can wait a few more months or years after all this. They still have a chance and time to kill this one.
They’ll cave. The checks on in the mail, and fresh slabs of pork are being passed around.
The thing is, at this point, the Democrats would be wise to pass off the interview baton, at all times, to Alan Grayson and Eric Massa.
Both of these men have the straight-up balls to be a frank and honest, if not brutally honest politician.
Can we co-opt those two into the CPC? Cause if we had Grayson and/or Massa whipping votes against this turd I imagine we’d have a pretty good shot of what we want.
Also, either man for Speaker. Sorry, Nancy, you don’t seem to be the kind of speaker I want anymore…
Grayson’s not going to be any help. He’s already come out in support of this trash. He’s in full “team player” mode now.
That’s news to me, I hadn’t heard that yet.
Extreme disappointment if that’s the case…
Oh, and while I’m on my OWN IT kick, we must also never forget.
The Democratic Party OWNS this shit. ALL of it. Whatever was given away or not included was for DEMOCRATS. Not a single Republican in the House or Senate voted for it.
100% Wholly Owned Democratic Party Bill. With a mandate to be a customer of a private industry, and a private industry with an anti-trust exemption. My God I feel like I’ve walked through the looking glass. Unbelievable.
Oh, well, you know it’s possible I’m misremembering that.
I could’ve sworn a saw him on the teevee like two weeks ago saying he would support it because “lives are at stake” or something.
Sorry, my mind might be confused. I already see a mistake in my post at 43 too. My mind is now telling me one Republican in the House did vote for the House bill.
I think.
Oh boy.
The Gov. is fully broken.
We’re just escaping the impending reality by busying ourselves with the very important issues the Gov. is serving up for us. The HCR agenda running parallel to the Fed Reserve throwing trillions at Wall Street – mere coincidence? – you think?
Amen.
Grijalva has been a star, IMO. Why is it a co-chairmanship?
You did. I saw it too. He said he doesn’t want people dying for lack of any bill. He said the alternative is the status quo and that’s unacceptable.
I’m worried now that all those Dem pledges to a vote NO without a public option can’t be relied upon. And FDL was asking us for contributions to people like Nadler, Woolsey, Barbara Lee, Grijalva, et al who assertively embraced their UNYIELDING positions on this HRC bill. I don’t trust most of them to follow through except for those time tested people like Kucinich who don’t cave in at the drop of a hat. Sending him contributions makes sense especially when he takes on the banksters.
Now that Obama is HANDS ON, policing everyone at Conference to make sure he has something, however hollow and shabby to sign, the American people may be out of luck.
Clyburn is now the worst sellout, saying he never bought into the public option.
If these are so called Progressives we have a lot to be concerned about. Until there is REAL campaign finance reform, most of these DEMS whether Blue Dogs or liberals to Progressives will be thinking about $$$ and re-election, and they will vote to please the highest bidder..
Yes this things is going to pass. Being an old man I have only one thing to say. LBJ. That stands for you know who. We are going to get Medicare( health reform) and Vietnam( afhganistan) and the libs are going to be told by the establisment Dems to shut up. Where is the 2012 Convention. If its in Chicago that would be perfect. When are the progressives going to figure out that they have been screwed. OH, we dont have the draft (yet).
Well of course not. While I agree with his sentiment how often does an actual “important” dem comment downthread on something. I just wish certain sites would post those things under press releases instead of diaries. One needs to at least interact for me to see it as anything but cheerleading.
Latest pol de jour that the blogsphere swoons over because he gets all hyperbolic about something. Atm I don’t care about someone’s words. Obama gives pretty speeches and turns right around and ignores everything he just said. Actions, results, policy, those are things to care about. Today is Massa because he spoke out and basically called Cheney a vile troll, big whoop, indict the SOB or censor him. I can give pretty speeches, but they have been given the authority to act, its time that they do.
Tim Holden used to be my congressman and then they redistricted everything and now the town of Reading, PA which is as Democratic a city as you’ll find was split between three congressmen including Jim Gerlach(mine) and the godawful Joe Pitts with Holden getting a slice. The county is mostly conservative but the city is not–and the city has been made politically obsolete on the congressional level because of the carving that has taken place.
It’s really as though we have no representative at all.
This makes challenging a conservative Dem in the primary very tough–much less a guy like Gerlach. But we keep trying. Actually Gerlach has had a few close races.
Here is the argument I keep hearing from the Democowards.”If we don’t pass this bill now,we won’t be able to do it later!”Question to Democoward;What about single payer or even a public option?Democoward answer”We’ll do it later”We need to start referring to this as The Insurance Industry Jackpot Bill!