Very illuminating.

Please try to do it live. This is great!

Awesome, and a much needed debate

AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…

Citizen David Dayen and the Firepup Freedom Fighters:

Now this is what I’m talkin’ about…this is what FDL does best!!! Enough of tryin’ ta find common ground with corporatists or playin footsie with RonPaulites, FDL has survived and grown because it has focused on issues from the left end of the political Mason-Dixon Line and as we discover, to no great surprise, most common folks identify with progressive solutions to real social problems.

So “let’s get ready to rumble”…God, I love a good clean fight!!!

KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE AMMUNITION, ALL THEY GOT LEFT IS THE WORTHLESS MONEY!!

Great, David, but is it possible to get Marcy into the discussion? At least to debate the cost issue for middle class folks?

This is fantastic work on your part!

Popcorn for all!!!

I think Jon can well represent that position. Meanwhile, this isn’t necessarily the last of these debates you may see on the site, so there could be ample opportunity for Marcy to do one down the road.

good post accept for the part about the “RonPaulites.” Healthcare legislation won’t do much good if inflation goes so high that people won’t be able to afford even the basic necessities.

Less interested in sketchy online video, more interested in a podcast/audio recording or a transcript. Is that planned?

Excellent!

Cool.

Citizen profreedom:

If you are indeed what yer monicer says (“profreedom”) then you will understand that Ron Paul and his pseudo libertarian tripe has nothin’ to do with “freedom” or the solving of problems to make the condition of people better but the accual of power by a few who don’t have it over all the rest of us who don’t.

all will be revealed…

an unmoderated, 45-minute back-and-forth exchange

informative and… entertaining!

Any way you can publicize the exchange in a way that gets the attention of (at least a few of) our legislators? Couldn’t hurt…

OT: Trainwreck on the horizon…

Epic!

Definitely looking forward to hearing them debate. Long overdue.

huge
huge

Can.Hardly.Wait. Jon is going to take Nate to school.

if there was ever a reason to donate to this site, it is for bringing things like this to the public. Fantastic.

Great idea. I hope it’s later in the day, so I can watch live. FDL rocks!

Great. We get to witness another apologist trot out the CBO’s corporate marketing datasheet misinformation with numbers that mean nothing, who will rail about “what other options do we have? This is all we’re going to be able to accomplish.” No thanks. You can smack him down with an item by item argument all day long and in the end, we’re still going to get a massive capitulation to the very industry that put us where we are now, with a guarantee of profits for poor performance and service, lives still lost, and bankruptcies galore. Either of these two bills is a mafia style extortion racket. Good luck with the verbal exchange, I won’t be watching. The system is rigged. The voting system is rigged. I’m looking around for a pitchfork and a ride to DC.

To say nothing of the “high rate of inflation” bugabear. The Friedmanites scream about inflation as their world crashes down around their ears from greed.

Will there be someone at the debate able to remind both parties of the enormous gap between either position regarding the current “reform” legislation today and what the Democrats promised us 18 months ago on the campaign trail?

Here is how I summed it up on another health care thread:

A year ago many progressives anxiously awaited the Inaugguration. Of Obama to the White House and a majority of Democrats to Congress.

Things were about to change after 8 years of BushWorld.

For example, health care. Single payer, here we come!!

Now here we are discussing the pros and cons of “allow[ing] states to set up multiple regional subsidiary exchanges within a single state.”

So, which is the greater “victory”?

Ten months ’til the November elections. Ten months to go about creating the conditions for a real victory

So, at the very least both proponents need to agree that, at best, the current debate revolves around a pyrrhic victory.

Can’t wait.

Nice work David, although this won’t change the outcome WRT the present HCR sitch, it WILL be fun to watch as Mr. Walker cleans the clock of Mr. Silver, mops the floor with his backside and in general makes light of the voodoo numerical analyses Mr. Silver loves to jumble to make his points.

Because a good numbers person can make the numbers tell any story they want told.

This is great, these are the kind of reality debates we need!

Excellent idea! Looking forward to it. Hope you have a transcript posted afterwards.

Couldn’t have been said better by you.

Two men enter, one man leaves.

Looking forward to it. I think Nate is persuadable if evidence is presented to him.
IMHO, his judgment on this is flawed by his focus on metrics, and very likely, by his , ahem, youth.

You sound pretty sure that Jon is older than Nate. Unless you’re saying that Nate’s “focus” is hindered by his advanced years.

I’m looking forward to the debate, too. There are good arguments on both sides.

Last Wonk Standing !

oh hell yeah – fantastic work David – thank you

Cool, I’m definitely going to check it out, we need more of this talking “with” rather than “at” or “against” as is common for solo blog posts.

Good news. I will definitely tune in, though I don’t see why Nate Silver is qualified. Are we debating the evolution of poll numbers and how we change that? I would rather watch Jon Walker debate Ezra Klein. After all Nate should of kept his first slogan, because he doesn’t do politics right at all.

So we have to debate ourselves because Erick Erickson at Red State Ann Coulter, Malkin etc are afraid of the Net roots Hmm? I like it Nate does know Selise will be hunting for bear:)
I’ll be going for smaller game but I’m not a bad hunter myself.

I think that Nate’s motivation here is fear — fear that not having any kind of health bill, even an outright harmful one, will doom us in November, just like in 1994 as Rahm keeps telling everyone on background. Except, of course, that Rahm’s backstabbing the Dem base with NAFTA, on top of the DADT fiasco, was a much bigger factor in the 1994 debacle.

The thing is that the apologists for the Senate bill have been telling themselves the same lies about it so much and so consistently that they’ve tricked themselves into believing them — which makes for interesting reactions when they’re confronted with inconvenient facts.

We may even bring this one to you live

sounds great. thanks. the more the light, the more information, the more voices, the better.

The thing is that the apologists for the Senate bill have been telling themselves the same lies about it so much and so consistently that they’ve tricked themselves into believing them — which makes for interesting reactions when they’re confronted with inconvenient facts.

looks like same story re the house bill.

actually, looks like same story re the whole neoliberal public/private competition policy being pushed by dems.

Will there be a replay available? Would it be OK to record and replay the debate on my internet radio station? There’s a contact link on the link behind my nic or email mail@bluerootsradio

I’d like to run it and then have a live call-in and hear from folks are are/will be affected by this bill.

Thanks