We have plenty of people here at FDL willing and plenty able to deal with the Wikileaks release of State Department cables (the entire result of which will be, probably, more debriefings in person and on the telephone instead of by email or telegram). But I’ve been struck by the emphasis in the documents on Iran. If the cables are to be believed, the entire Arab world wants them bombed and don’t want their fingerprints on the bombing. Top officials from Qatar, Jordan, Oman, Bahrain, Saudi Arabia and the UAE basically concurred that they want something done with Iran before they become a nuclear power and tip the balance in the region. The Egyptian President even intimated that Iran sponsored terror, though he would not say it publicly.
I think we have to account for the fact that these Arab nations want weapons from the United States and don’t necessarily offer unvarnished opinions even confidentially to diplomats as much as they tell people what they want to hear. But the idea that Arab nations would be fearful of a nuclear power in their region is not only a banal thought, it was said at the time by lots of liberals as a potential negative cause of the Iraq war. It was beyond clear at the time that an invasion of Iraq would eliminate the Sunni/Shia buffer zone in the region and tip the balance of power toward the Iranians, and certainly the Saudis, for example, would oppose that consequence. The Arab world right now doesn’t have what you’d consider a paradise, but certainly a belligerent power at their doorstep would give them cause for worry. You didn’t have to see it in print in confidential cables to recognize that.
I agree that you’re going to start seeing warmongers use these Arab governments as proof that Iran’s nuclear program must be dealt with. The proper response is that this was entirely prefigured by the neocon invasion of Iraq. That’s exactly what Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak told John Kerry in one Wikileaks cable, that “as a result of the invasion of Iraq, Iran is spreading everywhere.” It destabilized the region, just like liberals said it would. And an Iranian invasion to compensate for a failed Iraqi invasion would be just as destabilizing if not more so. That’s particularly true from an economic sense, because it would trigger an energy crisis, as a separate Wikileak acknowledges.
What also emerges here is the idea that Iran has advanced their nuclear weapons capabilities beyond the publicly available National Intelligence Estimates, and that some of the advance comes from North Korea:
Secret American intelligence assessments have concluded that Iran has obtained a cache of advanced missiles, based on a Russian design, that are much more powerful than anything Washington has publicly conceded that Tehran has in its arsenal, diplomatic cables show.
Iran obtained 19 of the missiles from North Korea, according to a cable dated Feb. 24 of this year. The cable is a detailed, highly classified account of a meeting between top Russian officials and an American delegation led by Vann H. Van Diepen, an official with the State Department’s nonproliferation division who, as a national intelligence officer several years ago, played a crucial role in the 2007 assessment of Iran’s nuclear capacity.
The missiles could for the first time give Iran the capacity to strike at capitals in Western Europe or easily reach Moscow, and American officials warned that their advanced propulsion could speed Iran’s development of intercontinental ballistic missiles.
Again, this could be expected in a world where nuclear proliferation is allowed to go unchecked, much like the world where the START treaty elapses and the perfectly reasonable follow-on treaty never gets out of the Senate.
A lot of these reports seem pretty dangerous, particularly the idea that Iran is abusing the Red Crescent to smuggle weapons into war zones. But overall, I get the sense that the cables reveal a world wanting to tell America what it wants to hear. It’s a small miracle that we haven’t dropped a bomb on Iran at this point, but warmongers are almost certain to selectively use Wikileaks, when it isn’t wanting to declare them a terrorist organization, to argue for another war.



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We need a wiki leaks for the financial sector and its interaction with our legislators to see what is really been going on.
We need a wiki leaks on what went on behind closed doors on healthcare.
Interesting WikiLeaks find from Juan Cole regarding Dennis Blair and McChrystal in 2009. Blair lied to Congress with impunity, while McChrystal lied to Obama, regarding Iran supplying arms to the Taliban.
From 11/29/2010 http://www.juancole.com/
And heeeeeeere’s Berlusconi, compliment of wikileaks:
“An intriguing alliance: American diplomats in Rome reported in 2009 on what their Italian contacts described as an extraordinarily close relationship between Vladimir V. Putin, the Russian prime minister, and Silvio Berlusconi, the Italian prime minister and business magnate, including “lavish gifts,” lucrative energy contracts and a “shadowy” Russian-speaking Italian go-between. They wrote that Mr. Berlusconi “appears increasingly to be the mouthpiece of Putin” in Europe. The diplomats also noted that while Mr. Putin enjoys supremacy over all other public figures in Russia, he is undermined by an unmanageable bureaucracy that often ignores his edicts.”
LINK.
AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
Citizen David Dayen:
The push to legitimize attackin Iran has started already and Josh Marshall over at TPM has slithered in with a post emphasizin’ how “everyone” in the Middle East is pushin for an attack on Iran EXCEPT Israel (who’d a thunk it). Time to focus the rebuildin’ of the Democratic Party around the wars and jobs. No economic or social issue can gain any traction unless it’s tied to gettin outta Iraq and Viet Nam II.
KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE AMMUNITION, NOPLACE TO HIDE ANYMORE.
even Josh Marshall at TPM thinks this latest cherry picked dump is at attack on the US…
— oy.
I’m watching the Lord of all Fatheads calling for Assanges death.
Most people think he’s an idiot.
I think he’s a genius.
He is a genius at finding brilliant groundbreaking new ways to be an idiot. He’s the Albert Einstein of ignorant and irrational thought.
He’s now doing the “Assange is a rapist, where does he live so we can kidnap him and kill him etc etc etc.”
That crazy bitch claire mccaskill is just as bad.
Can’t they have one ****ing talking head say, “Maybe it’s good that this came out.” Or, “maybe we SHOULDN’T be the House of Sauds hired guns.”
I’ll continue to watch Fathead and marvel in the way that he’ll blaze a trail into the forest of ignorance going where no idiot has gone before.
Funny you should mention that. The NYT – ya know: that ever so liberal pos – had a fancy-schmancy “connect the dots” complete with photos thingie going on all about how all these Middle Eastern potentates were breathing fire to gun down Iran… with lots of incendiary quotes to go with the photos of these potentates dressed in their royal garb complete with ceremonial knives ‘n stuff.
Funny – eh? As in: not funny ha ha, but funny smells fishy to me.
“Interesting” that everyone just “happens” to be focusing on the Iran and how all these Middle Easterners want to attack Iran. Why how convenient, and how convenient for the USA to suddenly become bff with *these* Muslims, as opposed to “other” Muslims that we decide not to like.
Funny thing, that.
I’d love to see that one, but I think I already know what’s what with that. But maybe it would serve to wake up a few more citizens if Wikileaks were able to reveal that wheeling ‘n dealing.
This is the Saudis, etc., doing the old:
“Let’s you and him fight.” thing.
The crunch on Iraq is probably going to come in early-to-mid-2012, or, about the time when Obama’s poll numbers start taking the final plunge. 18 months ago, I would have laughed at anyone who was positing that he would attack Iran or allow Israel to do it. Now, it’s like we’re talking about George Bush: there is nothing so stupid or bloody or venal that it’s off the table for him to use to try to save his political ass.
I know it would be insane to go after Iran.
As we now indisputably know, it was also insane to invade Iraq.
How about for the next election, we dispense with the election and drop a bunch of names in a hat…culled from a randomly-selected group of winos sleeping under overpasses.
“And the killing goes on and on…”
http://news.antiwar.com/2010/11/29/afghan-police-officer-kills-six-nato-troops/
It just came out that all six were Americans.
Iran has missiles that can reach Europe who cares its the missiles that can reach oil tankers in the Persian Gulf that worry me.
America wants to attack Iran however if Iran sinks just one oil tanker gas prices will go up $1 easy
It puts the whole thing in perspective as far as motives. Wikileaks is either being used or is a conspirator with the pernicious forces arrayed against Iran.
“…and tip the balance in the region…”
Attacking Iran will be a balance-fucker-upper that won’t whoa.
The only way the “balance” can be sustained (short-term) is by permanent occupation of Iraq. The moment we leave, in fact, when any further drawdown (IF it happens…) occurs, the various factions will be flexing their muscles in the streets. No stopping that, nor, the results of it, without keeping that 50,000 troop contingent in place.
Now, we just need someone to admit that Iraq is now a permanent client state of ours…albeit a rather unhappy one.
You know what frightens me.
I expect americans to be smart enough to know that these new revelations prove that the sauds are opprotunistic assholes who are the major funders of anti american terror groups and are trying to destroy us economically by continuous wars with their enemies…
But noone should ever underestimate the stupidity of the majority of american people.
I have a feeling the dumbest 20% of the country that votes in disproportionately large numbers will see this as “ZOMGZ WE HAVE AN ALLY! LETZ DOO THIS SHIZ!” and flush “america” down the drain.
Alank, I don’t think that publishing proof that the Saudis and their ilk want us (and/or Israel) to do Iran, is going to lead to that reality.
Not immediately. We all know what the consequences would be, world-wide.
The risk-window is going to be open in 2012, when we have a president with flop-sweat running off his head in rivulets, desperately looking for some way to recoup some of the mojo that he’s handed the republicans like he was passing out free cookies.
At that point, Obama and the dems are going to have to make a decision as to whether or not “saving” his presidency to the extent of his having even a chance at another term, will be worth starting a mid-east war.
The word that I got is that Wikileaks is an Israeli run effort to embarass the Obama admin in the world view. Israelis are the only winners in this deal.
Right on!!!
U.S. war against Iraq was won by Iran. So now everyone in the region, esp those with significant pops in the Shia (oil) crescent want to double down by bombing Iran! Works for me. /s
This is an eye opener for me. I thought that only the USG was particularly stupid about that part of the world. Didn’t realize that leaders of those countries were equally stupid.
If you were Iran what would you do?
the USA has a way of not attacking nations with NUKES!
Iraq was always under the control of the USA, Iran was always a Russian Out Post.
Iran has been attacked by the USA before via Iraq. (yes the USA, supported Iraq during the Iraq/Iran war.
Israel the most hated nation in the mid-east has NUKES, and the puppet states in the mid-east want to attack Iran? WOW
the USA intel says attacking Iran, will unite the arab street, and probably topple some of their puppet states. (the arab street and their leaders are in two different worlds, sorta like the USA, most USA citizens hate their govt.)
Russia would love the USA to attack Iran, being that RUSSIA is the largest Oil producer in the WORLD, the price of OIL will go thru the ROOF, making RUSSIA very RICH! and POWERFUL
By the way, Iran is a real nation, this is not going to be the Iraq war, if you attack Iran you will unite IRAN, and IRAN will attack back.
Iran will probably point some of their missiles toward SAUDIA ARABIA oil fields.
Yes? and the USA will go into a SUPER DEPRESSION, so will EUROPE!
Also China and Russia stop using the dollar to trade oil and other goods. (CNN, ABC, MSNBC, NBC, FOX, the so call news of the USA did not mention this over the holidays, this is VERY BIG NEWS)
Once oil stop being traded using the dollar, GAME OVER for USA!!!
Is the USA going to attack Russia or China? No! they have NUKEs that can reach DC. (Iraq stopped trading Oil using dollars and was sent to the stone age, Iraq did not have any NUKES that could reach DC)
David. The sheiks were just telling the Americans what they thought the Americans wanted to hear. Meanwhile, they tell their own people that they are BFF with other countries in the Middle East. Obama does this all of the time, when he says one thing to the press for ‘public’ consumption then goes and does what the military, the banks, the rich, and the corporations want him to do. Like Obama, they are lying no matter who they are talking to.
the arab street and their leaders don’t live on the same planet.
attack Iran and the USA may lose some of their puppet states in the mid-east.
I appreciate your points, but this epiphany you expect of the current White House by 2012 seems highly unlikely based on current trends. I perceive this leak a purposeful one that’s meant to ratchet up the bellicose posture of the U.S. and her allies in Israel. It seems possible that Wikileaks is being used by the White House for propaganda purposes.
I know that the leaders & the pops are 2 diff animals. However, I’d have thought that local leaders would have some awareness of blowback that the USG obviously doesn’t have.
As far as just telling the USG what they want to hear, I’m not convinced. After all, the USG is gonna sell them, or give them arms, no matter what they say. And another war in the area could ‘resolve’ the diffs between the street & the leaders in a way that the leaders might not find to their benefit.
What would bush do, attack next year.
So what’s to stop obama from doing the bush tap dance on Iran ?
I agree!
USG intel probably says attack Iran, and the USA is going to lose some of their puppets in the mid east. (talk is TURKEY has already broke free of USA influence)
Saudia Arabia has to be pissed about the fact the USA gave Iraq to Iran.
So what is the latest on the cables to follow? According to the Guardian “WikiLeaks says that, contrary to the state department’s fears, it also initially intends to post only limited cable extracts, and to redact identities.” What percentage are available now? When are the rest going to become available? If they are so into transparency then what is the delay?
Assange promised a reformation by the end of the year. Does that mean that by the end of the year everybody will think that Pakistan (as per the last release) and Iran (as per this release) are the bad guys? 33 days left for the reformation. Woo hoo.
Talk about controlling the news cycle. Lindsey Lohan and Bill Clinton got nothing on this operation. Honestly, this Wikileaks thing is like not knowing whether you are going to get laid and starting to doubt whether you even want to.
It seems pretty clear Israel is intimately connected to this “leak.”
Even with the huge volume of information there’s very little critical of Israel, and much that supports the preferred US-Israeli dogma (don’t question the story of 9-11, bin Laden is still alive, Iran is the threat, etc.).
Whether what was provided to WikiLeaks is outright falsehood, or simply a biased sampling of unverifiable and even outright wrong but physically real documents (much like all the “information” before the Iraq War “confirming” Iraq was developing WMD’s), is immaterial.
So here’s how the scam works: the disinformation is released, then the public faces of authority can “denounce” its release, giving the false story the appearance of accuracy and legitimacy.
The large volume of accurate but essentially insignificant and already well-known material serves to mask the important bits of falsehood, much like food hides from an animal the pill hidden within.
Finally, the faux “attack on America” and “damage” to “national security” can be used as justification for real censorship of the Internet as a whole.
Think of this as a false flag attack on the public perception of Israel’s targets, and on the freedom of the Internet itself.
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And this AFP story provides confirmation for us:
Israel says WikiLeaks shows ‘consistency’ on Iran
By Hazel Ward (AFP) – 13 hours ago
JERUSALEM — Israel expressed satisfaction on Monday after the mass release of US diplomatic cables by WikiLeaks, saying it proved the Jewish state’s position on Iran was consistent — in public and in private.
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Just like Netanyahu’s very first words about 9-11: “It’s very good.”
WeakiLeaks also reveals that Saudi donors are chief financiers of al Qaeda (see link below). So I guess this means that the US can team up with Saudi Arabia to hire al Qaeda terrorists to drop bombs on Iran. I’m not sure how our warmongering chicken hawks would react to this news, but something tells me that war is such an intoxicating drug to them that they’re willing to use friends as foes to wage more wars in the world!
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/11/shocker-admits-saudi-donors-chief-financiers-al-qaeda-leaked-cable/
If Julian Assange were to move into a multimillion dollar mansion in the Hamptons and spend his weekends playing golf with Lloyd Blankfein and other sleazy vampire squids, then I’d know that he sold his soul to Zionist devils on Wall Street. But until I hear this, I’ll continue to believe that Julian Assange is a fierce enemy of the Zionist state of Israel!
But I’m sure that he knows that he’d be a dead man by now if he were to tread too heavily on Israel. Self preservation is what’s keep him from exposing too much bloody dirt on Israel.
Wikileaks promises a massive release re a massive US Bank – internal memos, letters, emails, messages – in the next year, so you may get your wish in about a year.
They also promise a more modest size release on a massive Drug company in that 12 to 18 month time frame.
I am beginning to like Wikileaks.
weak tea – that Israeli conspiracy idea
One fellow did the cable and memo theft – a Pfc with a low level security clearance that used a RW CD that had music on the way in and documents on the way out of his work station. He did not do a selective dump – just a massive site sub-section download, compress and write to the CD, and erase. The download activity was not monitored – but I suspect that will change soon.
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
So far, the Wiki leaks is much ado about gossip.
If anyone doesn’t think that every country’s ambassador’s don’t give frank assessments of host countries political leaders, they are dreaming. That is why no country is really going to be upset–they know they do the same thing.
If Iran didn’t know that it’s neighbors didn’t like them, they’d have to be stupid. If they didn’t think that the Saudi’s and others would like to see their facilities bombed, they’d have to be imbeciles.
They aren’t.
Newspapers will flap their gums, but who cares?
So, pfc Manning is going to spend the rest of his life in jail for essentially nothing. No result. No change in anything. Nothing.
Hope he enjoys it. Spending your life in jail as a hero who changed the world is one thing. Spending your life in jail for nothing is an entirely different matter.
From the Jerusalem Post: Analysis: Wikileaks vindicate, don’t damage, Israel
Gee, how unexpectedly convenient.