The latest on Don’t Ask Don’t Tell repeal is this. The Senate needs a legislative vehicle to take up repeal. So the House gutted a bill called the “Enhancing Small Business Research and Innovation Act of 2009,” substituted with the legislative DADT repeal, and will pass it in the House, returning it to the Senate as a “privileged message.” This would allow Harry Reid to call it up with only one cloture vote in the way, reducing the amount of time it would take to pass the bill. This also gets around the motion to recommit in the House.
Reading this just makes me sad. Not because the parliamentarians devised some way to accelerate passage of a DADT repeal, but because it takes so much ridiculous hoop-jumping to get there. We have a legislative structure tied up in so many silly conventions of parliamentary procedure, because the powers that be will not just do what’s necessary and create a governing body that can simply pass items by majority vote. They can do this in a fashion that respects the views of the minority by allowing a set amount of amendments, but without the ability for extreme obstruction and delay of items which have majority support. We’re seeing that again today with Jim DeMint forcing the START treaty to be read out loud, which he admits is merely a delaying tool.
Next year, at the beginning of the next Congress, the Senate has the opportunity to change its rules by a majority vote. Tom Udall has been pushing this all year; he calls it “the Constitutional option.” Udall would ask for a ruling from the chair, probably Joe Biden, to make a ruling on the ability of the Senate to change the rules. If Republicans object, Democrats will move to table their objection, and they only need 51 votes to uphold it. After that, the Senate can rewrite the rules.
Some old-line Democrats have been wary of this approach, but you get the sense that they are completely fed up with how the Senate operates. So they have set a date – January 5 – to attempt to change the rules.
Sen. Tom Harkin (D-Iowa), who has championed a weakening of the procedural mechanism that allows the minority party to hold up legislation, predicted “fireworks” on Jan. 5, 2011 — the day on which the Senate can, he argued, revamp its rules by a simple majority vote.
“There could be some fireworks. There could be some fireworks on January fifth,” Harkin said at a pro-reform event sponsored by several like-minded organizations. “I’m going to be there. I’m armed. I’m armed with a lot of history, and I know the rules, and I know the procedures too, so we will see what happens on the fifth.”
“[Former Sen.] Robert Byrd in 1975, the last time that last time that we changed the rules and [brought the filibuster threshold] from 67 [votes] down to 60, actually stated on the floor that a majority, 51 senators, could change the rules. And that’s what we intend to do and that is what we are working on right now. We are coming on the fifth to basically send a motion to the vice president … that will change the rules and there is a procedure to provide 51 votes to do that. Robert Byrd said that in 1975 and that’s what we are going to try to do.”
Separately today, Sherrod Brown affirmed that there would be a move to get the Senate to change the rules.
What form that rules change would take is still a bit unclear. Jeff Merkley has a proposal to limit the filibuster and force hardship on the Senators carrying it out, while still allowing for minority rights through amendments. Other proposals are out there. Several progressive groups have formed a coalition to reform the filibuster, and their principles align with the Merkley and the Udall plans.
Udall spoke with Rachel Maddow last night about the Constitutional option. This is definitely happening. We’ll see if there are 51 votes to table the objection. But Harkin hinted today that Republicans are bargaining to ensure that the final product would not reach too far. So I’d say something will change after January 5; we just don’t know what yet.




42 Comments

Support this site!
Subscribe to the newsletter
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About FDL News Desk
I have said in earlier posts that this is a potential trap. If, in the 2012 election, we lose control of the senate, it will be helpful to have the ability to stop or at least slow legislation that we really do not like. The Senate is one place where the minority must be considered and if we are in the minority we will appreciate that provision.
To that end, consider that we could be more vulnerable in the next election than in the last. It is at least conceivable that we could lose 4 or more of the 23 Senate seats now in our hands, that the President would lose and that the House will remain in their hands.
If that ends up being the case, the Senate will be our trump card to avoid an agenda that is 180 degrees from what we would want to see.
You actually think McConnell won’t get rid of the filibuster on day one? Or any time Dems even think of fighting back?
How many judges were obstructed? 5% – thats all it took to piss of Republicans. Obama has 39% of his judges in.
DDay, I trust your judgement on matters such as these. Do you think this is a real attempt to affect change in the Senate or is this pandering to the base? Most of the Ds in the Senate campaigned on filibuster reform. Are they just putting on a public show to demonstrate an attempt to keep that promise, a la Obama?
Of course, the down side to everything is that the new R house will pick up the obstructionist baton quite willingly and happily
20008-2010 Democrats need 60 votes to pass anything. Nearly every vote had 53-57 votes, thus falling short. Our last, best hope for a progressive rebound from 30 years of conservative misrule, frittered away.
2010-2012 Republicans will need 51 votes, which they will easily get with a few defections from pseudo-Dems. With the exception of running the committees, they will pretty much run the place.
Yup. Looks like the time for reform is NOW.
Wow. Id love to have that old radio (and possibly the tubes therin): )
I hate to say it but this new deficit-increasing tax law has taken all of the wind out of my sails. Sure, the Dems are racing against the clock to now repeal DADT which should have been repealed long ago – if not by congress, then by a presidential order from Obama. So this kind of kabuki dance is all for show at this point. The dems know they’re losing their base of support over the tax bill. Now their premiere legislation, Obama’s diluted/watered-down insurance program for the healthcare industry, is tanking so they’re grasping at straws in the final seconds of this game. I think the game is over, for all intents & purposes. The people are screwed and the entire government if “bought”.
And just wait for the new Tbags to come into congress and demand fiscal accountability which, in line with this new (unpaid)$700 billion of tax cuts for the rich, will mandate that all social programs and education be cut to the bone.
If the dems think they’re in trouble now, just wait for the other shoe to drop.
Why this president and Dems couldn’t see this coming as a result of what they’ve just done is beyond comprehension.
But maybe that’s just it, isn’t it? Maybe it’s all been a major kabuki dance to lure the middle class into actually believing that the Republicans (and now the Dems) hadn’t sold the store right out from under us long ago?
These procedures are pathetic.
Why do people in the ranks of the Democratic Party like Lawrence O’Donnell think it’s more important to conform to them than to do what’s best for the American people? Republicans seem to navigate through them just fine when they’re in power and want to pass their garbage…
Hard for me to believe that the Senators will agree to this. Each of them, particularly the conservative Democrats in today’s Senate, has a lot more power when there’s a super majority needed for cloture.
BTW, over at MyDD, MainStreetInsider details the procedure of how such a vote would go. Apparently, this is a once-a-session opportunity.
I like how Senate Ds push filibuster reform after loosing the House which can now play the role the Senate used to play (killing Progressive legislation) should the reform carry. Maybe they’ll succeed just in time to lose the Senate to Rs at which point they can say “oh sorry, we’re powerless now that the filibuster is no longer an option”. Call me cynical…
Yep, that’s how I see it.
They were powerless when their was an option. They always seemed to find some excuse not to filibuster, though. This just makes it easier.
They failed to use that power before when they were in the minority. I don’t see why they would now.
The effect of this is to turn the Senate over to the Republicans in Jan 2011 instead of Jan 2013. Obama will need only four let’s-not-weaken-our-President Democrats instead of thirteen – not that he’s had any real trouble finding invertebrates in the Senate so far.
So, after two years of unadulterated delay when the Democrats have a majority in both the House and Senate, they finally get sick and tired and willing to change the rules once they lose the House Majority????
WTF???
Correct me if I’m wrong, but couldn’t they make this rule change tomorrow? Is there a rule that says that it can only happen at the beginning of a session?
This is just theater. Have you noticed how when they want more war or more money for billionaires they can get over 80 votes?!! Until we have more than a handful of Democrats willing to fight against the worst of the worst legislation what possible difference does it make? Besides, they totally love “we don’t have the votes”. It’s their all purpose excuse for never ever under any circumstances passing a progressive bill.
The problem is the party not the procedure.
“Is there a rule that says that it can only happen at the beginning of a session?”
Even if such a rule exists, can’t they simply suspend the rules??
This is a pretty lengthy read but from what I gather it’s simply tradition that rules be changed at the beginning of a new session. I didn’t see restrictions prohibiting rule changes during session.
You’re wrong. They only get to do this at the beginning of the session. See the link I embedded in comment # 10.
I think there are other ways to do this, but this procedure only seems to apply at the start of the session. The “nuclear option” is one way to get around that on points of order or some such. Even the Republicans, the last time they had the Senate, only threatened to use that one, though.
greybeard it may be a trap if it occurs.
But I think this is all hot air Kabuki theatre…this is another attempt by the Dems to mollify the base… make you think they are interested in doing something.
At any given point during the legislative process,the Dems have as many as 5-8 Dems who are joining the GOP to stall legislation……If the leadership were really into passing Dems legislation you would never have so many Dems going off the reservation…maybe 1 or 2.
And so that’s why I think this is Kabuki theatre.
“Why this president and Dems couldn’t see this coming…”
I don’t believe for a nanosecond that the dems and particulary the president didn’t see this coming. What Obama wants, Obama gets.
Those Dems that go to the other side are the more conservative Blue Dogs. Some of them got the boot this past election. I have a strong feeling that more will get it in two years. In fact, there will be a whole slew of crooks to get fired in two years.
“The problem is the party not the procedure.”
The simplest explanation is usually the best
“…this is another attempt by the Dems to mollify the base…”
Are we really as stupid as they think we are?
Do they really want to modify the rules now that any changes will be more likely to benefit republicans?
5 or 6 dino blue dogs, republican party unity, a republican lite president and simple majority rule in the senate allows the republicans to start implementing their agenda in January 0f 2010.
Actually, there is. Each Senate can bind itself for its own two-year duration, and this one has; fixing the rules immediately would require an unattainable 60-vote (or more?) supermajority. But it cannot (Constitutionally) bind the next Senate, which can set its rules with a simple 51-vote majority. See DDay’s previous post, including the comments:
http://news.firedoglake.com/2010/12/10/brennan-center-report-shows-failure-of-broken-senate/
and the Brennan Center report itself:
Marziani MMD. Filibuster abuse. New York: Brennan Center for Justice at New York University School of Law; 2010. Available from: http://brennan.3cdn.net/d71924f77ec6e2aa64_3vm6b37f4.pdf
Everyone on Firedoglake should read this report in full.
Yes, and that’s exactly why intensive pressure is needed on this issue. Why is there not a Special Coverage category link for this issue on FDL’s homepage? Why is there not an online petition link as well? This will be the first important issue facing the next Congress.
If the Democrats were serious about doing anything they would have changed the filibuster rule two years ago. Most of the important legislation has already been passed. The damage has been done and the wealthy elite oligarchy has been well protected. They continue to reap record profits during the worst recession in 80 years, while the rest of the country is mired in high unemployment, lower wages, deflation, depleted home values, retirements, and savings. None of this happened by acccident.
Yeah, we always obstructed the GOP agenda when we were in the minority, right? Almost worked as well as getting progressive legislation for the majority of Americans while we hold the majority.
The Democratic Party is moribund.
Complete idiots. Change the rules just in time to hand the house to the thugs and the senate handover just over the next horizon.
These people are just plain clueless. They deserve ridicule.
The Senate should be disbanded. It’s a corrupt, un-democratic, dysfunctional sewer populated in the main by grafters, grifters, fascist lunatics and other assorted vermin.
Your right it is a huge trap and the democrats as usual are going to walk right into it. Why do it now when in two years the republicans are going to have the house, the senate, and the white house in their possession? With a republican controlled house there is not going to be any progressive legislation sent to the senate anyway. With Obama as president giving away the right to filibuster wld be a serious mistake for the democrats. But you know they are going to do it right?
Never thought I wld see my senator Senator Brown voting to extend the Bush tax cuts.
Actually, it’d be a “unique-in-Senate-history” violation of the rules – but I guess you could call that an “opportunity,” if you prefer breaking rules to changing them as the rules provide (at any time during a Senate session). Waiting for the beginning of the next Congress before pulling this destructive stunt is simply a way of attempting to shield the audacity of the planned violation of Senate Rule V, among others:
Not at all. In the Senate, rule changes may be made at any time that a simple majority of the Senate wants to change a rule (slowed by any actual filibuster – floor debate – that develops, or, if such floor debate can’t be waited out, and a cloture motion is filed by the majority to end it, by 67 votes on the cloture motion, and then a simple majority on final passage of the rule change).
Senate Democrats do something bold and decisive?
BWAAAAAAAAAA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-!!!!!!
No, Cujo359, you’re wrong. The Senate does not “only get to [change its rules] at the beginning of the session.”
capecodmercury is right.
Senate Rule V is unconstitutional if it is interpreted as binding future Senates. Read Part IV of the Brennan Center report, “Changing the Senate’s rules at the start of the next Congress” (pages 14-20). Chief Justice John Marshall held in 1810 that “one legislature cannot abridge the powers of a succeeding legislature” (Fletcher v. Peck, 10 U.S. 87, 135 (1810), quoted on page 17 of the Brennan Center report). The rules of the 111th Senate bind only the 111th Senate itself – not the 112th Senate.
A particular Senate can require a supermajority to cloture a filibuster during its own term. That is why changing the Senate’s rules now – although technically possible – would be impossible in practice; the votes would not be there to cloture the inevitable filibuster.
The significance of the beginning of a Senate term is that – by custom (and common sense), and not by law – each Senate establishes its rules at the outset of its term, and it normally does so by reaffirming essentially the same rules used by the previous Senate. Since those rules require a supermajority to break a filibuster, and any attempt to change the rules to reform the filibuster would itself certainly be filibustered, that (usual) scenario effectively prevents filibuster reform from being adopted. So the Senate must adopt a different set of rules – with filibuster reform incorporated into them – as part of its initial establishment of its own rules.
The Senate’s rules have carried forward from one Congress to the next since the Senate was formed. To which “custom” do you refer?
I am familiar with the Bill Frist-era (and before) arguments intended to put a gloss of “constitutionality” on recurring schemes by power-hungry (or minority-hostile) members of the majority to violate Senate rules in order to avoid changing them as the rules provide. The Brennan Center report is hardly the first to explore this issue. How does its report differ from earlier treatments of this question (if you’ve read any of those earlier discussions), if at all?
1. Senate rules do not require anyone to use a supermajority to “break” a filibuster. There is an optional cloture rule available for that purpose, if and when a filibuster cannot be outlasted to reach a simple-majority final vote.
2. Since there hasn’t been a filibuster – as I define it, though I understand from the other thread that the definition of “filibuster” is irrelevant, or self-explanatory, to you – in the Senate in almost twenty years, on what credible basis do you claim that “any attempt to change the rules to reform the filibuster would itself certainly be filibustered”?
3. Since filibusters – again, as I define them – are essentially extinct in the Senate, what’s the urgency of “filibuster reform” – except perhaps to bring filibusters back to life, and with them the public debate that incumbent Senators loathe?
You have not cited any legal precedent to justify your assertions. I stand by the opinion of Justice Marshall that I cited, which is only one small part of the evidence presented in the Brennan Center report. The Senate’s rules are “carried forward” only in the sense that they reaffirmed at the start of each Senate term. Any assertion to the contrary is simply false as a matter of law and of historical fact.
The unconstitutionality of Senate Rule V was noted at the time of its (highly controversial) adoption in 1959 (page 16 of the Brennan Center report). Senator Jacob Javits (R-NY) denounced it as follows:
According to the Brennan Center report, even some of the Rule’s defenders
Rule V is not a legally binding rule, it is a merely a custom. And if it were actually a rule, it would be unconstitutional.
The citation given by the Brennan Center report for the above quotations from the debate over the adoption of Rule V is: 86 Congressional Record 124, 447-450 (1959).
You propose that I prove a negative to you? [That is, prove to you that the Senate's rules are not formally "reaffirmed at the start of each Senate term," but rather are - and have been throughout the Senate's history - simply carried forward from one Congress to the next without interruption, by custom and more recent rule.] How, exactly, do you propose that I prove that negative?
Please don’t limit yourself to Mimi Marziani’s arguments in the Brennan Center report in support of the radical proposals to profoundly disrupt and change historical parliamentary procedures and rules in the Senate. Dive in to the earlier work – which Mimi perhaps borrowed, or built upon – by Bill Frist’s loyal assistants, and start citing their many creative, if specious, arguments and cherry-picked debates, in support of your cause. There’s plenty of good Senatorial umbrage against minority rights and debate in the Senate to be found in that work, too; democratic debate often perturbs authoritarian-minded members of a majority. KrisAinCA even helpfully linked to that long, earlier work in this thread, @ 19 above.
Senate Standing Rule V, parts 1 and 2, is not a “legally binding” rule, or even a rule at all, of the United States Senate? Says who? Mimi Marziani? Perhaps you’d better alert the Senate Rules Committee, which lists Rule V, as linked, on its website, with all the other Standing Rules of the Senate.
Until ruled otherwise by the Senate or the courts, Rule V, part 2, is a binding Senate rule like all the other rules – not to mention the historical reality of the Senate. Doesn’t matter what the Supreme Court held in 1810 (since Rule V, not to mention longstanding post-1810 Senate order, doesn’t pretend to assert that a simple majority of a future Congress cannot change the rules that carry over from a previous Senate as the Constitution and those rules provide, in any way it pleases, at any time it pleases), or what Senators Jacobs, Hennings or Cooper (and quite a few others like them) said or believed about it, or a similar rule, at one time or another in the past.
But, then, those are the sort of specious arguments that one must make to ‘wipe the slate clean’ of any binding rule or precedent, for the first time in Senate history, at the beginning of the next Congress (in an effort to put a “constitutional” sheen on the any-old-time “nuclear” option), in order to force the majority Party’s will on the Senate without debate, and to otherwise avoid legitimately, honorably and thoughtfully changing Senate rules as those rules provide.
All of this, of course, remains a pointless distraction from the claimed reason for the “need” to change Senate rules at all: That the debating filibuster – something that unfortunately hasn’t been seen on the Senate floor in almost two decades (the close approximation of the Bernie Sanders speech last Friday notwithstanding) – is at “record levels” in the Senate, and must be quashed at all costs. The deceit of that audaciously-misleading claim is necessary in order to conceal the inconvenient truth that the present majority (Democratic) Party just can’t seem to control its voluntary abuse of the optional Senate cloture rule (must.prevent.floor.debate.and.amending.), by which the Party unnecessarily inflicts on the Senate cloture’s supermajority voting thresholds and painless (to the minority) delays of Senate business.
The destructive epidemic of voluntary majority filings of supermajority cloture motions decoupled from any obstructive minority debate on the floor, is now so routine, in lieu of public legislating, that some in the power-hungry majority hope for more: The power to more-formally preemptively silence (and easily ignore) a Senate minority, with less than 60 votes, while destabilizing with partisan bias the “regular order” of the Senate, provided that they can bamboozle and hoodwink enough of their gullible, short-sighted, and/or naive colleagues (having already succeeded with the media, by and large) to get away with it.