Thank you for covering this. Scout’s been at the Capitol for three days and it’s not stopping anytime soon.

All the national coverage is playing this as poor Scott Walker trying to balance the budget. It’s total bullshit.

A.

Yep. Walker has definitely won the media battle. On cnn this morning, among other gag producing coverage, they mentioned that all he was doing was trying to bring govt worker compensation in line with private workers.

Of course, that was a highly anticipatable talking point & will win the day bc private corp workers have been so beaten down, they hate the public workers, who they pay, getting more.

Wiconsinites, determine who the 12 Republican committee members who passed this were. Picket their homes, their churches on Sunday, their country clubs, etc.

Union members from Green Bay, Milwaukee, Eau Claire, etc. call out sick from your jobs, drive to Madison and protest at the Capitol.

Unions in northern Illinois and Minnesota, drive to Madison and join the protest in a show of solidarity.

Now is the time to escalate and to refuse to go home. Make these hate-filled Republicans back down.

Yeah, I wrote about that last night, he created the budget problem and then “balanced” it with non-budget ideological union-busting.

Now is the time to escalate and to refuse to go home. Make these hate-filled Republicans back down.

And may it spread nationwide, Egypt-style…

Outrageous. Maybe this will wake up some people.

In many ways, this is the wrong way to go about reforming the system.

The correct way is to eliminate the inherent conflict of interest when public employee unions contribute to political campaigns of the very people who will vote on their contracts. Essentially, they are bribing the officials who will vote on their contract to vote their way.

It is not different from a developer giving campaign money to an official who will be voting on their project. It stinks.

Public employee unions should be free to organize and bargain, but not to pay off those who vote on their contracts.

As someone said, it pits the private interest of the employees against the public interest of the citizens.

With the power to organize and bargain, the public employee unions have the same power as auto workers, steel workers, etc.

Unfortunately, I think the wild fire is spreading the other way.

I fully support the people in Wisconsin and this may very well spread nationwide. It should. They are pulling the same shyte here in Tennessee, which is already a Right-To-Be-Fired-ForNoReason state.

A-yep. The blogs are totally kicking the GOP/Media Complex’s asses on this story.

We’ll see. The corporate rocking chair media wants us to think so, but the word on the ground is totally different.

There are consequences to reflexive voting and it looks like the Republicans in Wisconsin at least are going to find out that there are consequences to arrogance.

Does my heart proud:

Instead of taking the day off, their students gathered at schools on the west and east sides of Madison and marched miles along the city’s main thoroughfares to join the largest mass demonstration the city has seen in decades – perhaps since the great protests of the Vietnam War era.
Thousands of high school students arrived at the Capital Square, coming from opposite directions, chanting: “We support our teachers! We support public education!”
Thousands of University of Wisconsin students joined them, decked out in the school’s red-and-white colors.
Buses rolled in from every corner of the state, from Racine and Kenosha in the southeast to Green Bay in the northeast, from La Crosse on the Mississippi River to Milwaukee on Lake Michigan.

http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2011/02/17-2
“What’s Disgusting?
Union-Busting!” They chanted.

Thanks, David. The great coverage by you, PW and Rayne is much appreciated.

circa 1982 Air Traffic Controller’s strike marked the beginning of the Reagon Gop assault on workers and unions.

Today, Obama is Reagan on steroids. I wonder how this maladministration is gonna finesse this with pretty words and spinelessness.

With the help of Digby, John Cole and Daily Kos no doubt.

I have to wonder how many of those protesting voted republican or stayed home and didn’t vote at all.

All over America, citizens are slapping their heads saying, “Damn, the Republicans are actually doing what they said they were going to do all along.” Imagine that.

I was thinking about the protester removed from the Hillary speech as more indicative of what can be expected. Preach democracy and freedom while brutalizing your own citizenry.

I love Rep. Ryan’s allegation that “Cairo has come to Madison.” WTF? Is he ready to send out “basijis” on horseback to beat the protesters? What a monster he and the GOP have turned out to be. I do hope the good people of Wisconsin tell them to shove it up their copious asses. It’s beyond disgusting.

I loved your story about “pix or it didn’t happen” with that radio asshole who claimed liberals were calling for violence.

Every single tweet I’ve seen has been about peaceful protest.

A.

Yep, that’s the problem. Well played. Absolutely blame the victims. Nice.

Wisconsin is on the verge of greatness being the first state in the union to finally break the bonds of the enemy within – DEMOCRACY. They’ll even beat Texas.

Free at last! Free at last! Freedom from democracy, free at last!!

Yeah, that too unfortunately. I still hope sHillary will come speak near me. I’ll do the same thing.

They are not victims if they are getting what they voted for. That’s the way democracy works.

A-yep. And the rest of the GOP nationwide is watching. If they’re made to pay a price here, they’re stopped here.

In an interview by Amy Goodman of Democracy Now on Tuesday, John Nichols of The Nation disputed Governor Scott “Dickhead” Walker’s claim that the State of Wisconsin is broke and must end collective bargaining for state employees to balance the budget. He said,

The fact is, Wisconsin is not broke. The Fiscal Bureau of Wisconsin just said in January that it will end this year with a $123 million surplus. So the fact of the matter is that this is not being done because of a lack of money. This is being done because political forces, conservative political forces, would like to disempower public employee unions and remove that voice for a strong public sector. That’s what austerity really translates as.

According to the Cap Times (h/t Fatster), Governor “Dickhead” created the deficit by passing legislation rewarding his cronies. Then he complained that the state was broke and insisted on killing collective bargaining for state employees in order to save the state’s budget. From the Cap Times,

To the extent that there is an imbalance — Walker claims there is a $137 million deficit — it is not because of a drop in revenues or increases in the cost of state employee contracts, benefits or pensions. It is because Walker and his allies pushed through $140 million in new spending for special-interest groups in January. If the Legislature were simply to rescind Walker’s new spending schemes — or delay their implementation until they are offset by fresh revenues — the “crisis” would not exist.
The Fiscal Bureau memo — which readers can access at http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/Misc/2011_01_31Vos&Darling.pdf — makes it clear that Walker did not inherit a budget that required a repair bill.

What an asshole.

Obama and the phony Dems in DC made all of this possible.

a below avg. Dem President would have destroyed the GOP, and kept them out of power for years.

Not OBAMA, Obama brought the GOP back to life.

Progressives have always considered the GOP a bunch of MORONS, but when you elect a CON MAN to be President name OBAMA, this is what you get.

Obama the TROJAN HORSE president created the current political climate in the USA.

Don’t blame progressives.

Exactly.

Thanks!

They (the flat earth people) have an overwhelming majority in the State Assembly.

In 1982 Raygun didn’t have the benefit of black box voting to stack state legislatures in his favor to support his union-busting tactics. Today, Republican President Obama does.

“all he was doing was trying to bring govt worker compensation in line with private workers.”

Public workers have negotiated for better benefits by taking LOWER wages. When wages and benefits are included public workers earn 8-9% less than those in the private sector. However, the wages and benefits of private sector FOLLOW and are determined by the public sector so when the public sector unions are wiped out wages and benefits will begin a downward spiral for both. Some state legs are already starting to repeal minimum wage and child labor laws.

“First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out –
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out –
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out –
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me — and there was no one left to speak for me.

The one’s that voted Dem and got a Repub POTUS are definitely beginning to slap their heads…votes for Governors, etc., are less surprising, however, the idiots that put those Repubs in power never believe anything will lower their own standard of living. There are two types of Repubs; the poor low-information types that want to turn the ME into glass and carry guns on their hips, want no taxes (because they are poor)are basically racist; and the other one’s that are rich and want all the money and no taxes (because they are rich) and will support anything that makes them richer at the expense of anyone. They both deserve what they voted for..too bad the weak and poor and old constantly get shafted. Repubs seem to be incredibly self-oriented either way. JMHO

Dropped my DH off at the bus at 7 am.

?????? And how about the corporations who buy politicians to vote for them?

“They’ll even beat Texas. “

I live in a district that is so overwhelmingly republican that the democrats could not put up a candidate. But the buses are rolling to Austin filled with people outraged that the legislature is doing what the republican candidates promised to do. I recently attended a meeting of the school district’s legislative committee where they praised the recent republican electee even as the only item on their agenda is to oppose the proposed budget cuts.

Agreed. Obama is a union-buster, despite what he says. I imagine his corporate masters invited him to a posh party when he froze federal workers’ pay. They probably let him join them for a round of golf when he applauded the firing of Rhode Island teachers. Obama: immature, narcissistic, suck-up to the wealthy.

“… Obama brought the GOP back to life.”

I couldn’t agree more.

” State’s top Catholic backs unions
Archbishop Listecki says state has “moral obligation” to do right by workers”

http://host.madison.com/ct/

I do believe and hope there will be many expressions and demonstrations in solidarity with the workers in Wisconsin. However no strong imperative to cease ind desist will come until the people recognize that this is not simply a Wisconsin problem or a Republican inspired agenda but systemic in our way of doing business and politics, now being enabled by the Obama administration

Gosh, what country have you been living in for the past decade? The govt you get here is the one the corps pay for.

Here’s the live feed, with pics.

http://www.thedailypage.com/daily/article.php?article=32306

Fuck Dictator Walker.

Community organizers learn early that for community funding they must suck up to the financial elites. Obama hated every minute when he did that. Like the Clintons, he vowed to become a part of that crowd. He did, and is now showing his appreciation for his membership. He is ably assisted by the great and ever-snoozing, Rip Van Holder, who holds no bad deed accountable if the money-crime is big enough.

can you please give a source or some data supporting that public workers make 8%-9% less than their private sector counterparts. I have seen this many times, even on the AFL-CIO site but no references. I don’t know how they come up with this. How do you compare teachers to the private sector.

One thing that I believe gets lost in this point is that wages and benefits are not determined by college costs, or comparable jobs but rather by what the jobs brings to the employer. An employer, be it a state or business cannot pay its employees more than they bring into the employer by their work, at least not for very long. When I worked at McDonalds I was paid maybe $9/hr and it was worth every penny to both of us. I worked harder their menatlly and physically every day compared to my current mill job but the revenue is much greater in my mill, thus they can afford to pay me more because my work brings in more revenue.

“Texas’ll even beat yo’ ass. “

Hope this goes viral.

A Fascist State!

No he likes sucking up, it’s his skill. Sucking up to any and all is how Obama got elected.

In the US, jobs are disappearing. Corporations, with concern only for their bottom line and with no sense of “patriotism”, are outsourcing to other countries.

In my state, Colorado, median household income in 2010 was lower than it was in 2000. And our Fiscal Policy Institute estimates that if job growth were to have kept pace with working age population growth since 2007, the state is short over a quarter of a million jobs.

I listened to a State Senator at a legislative breakfast this week justify the draconian cuts they are making to our state’s educational system (already we are just above Mississippi in dollars expended per student). She suggested school districts “outsource” and “privatize.” Which is just code for cutting salaries and benefits for those employees (school bus drivers, cafeteria “ladies”, maintenance people) who are already at the margins.

Then she burbled on about the great opportunities that awaited us to start our own small businesses. She mentioned “donut shops” as one venture that might tempt us.

I thought about the small business owners that I know. The house painters, a husband and wife team, who work 7 days a week. The wife cried on my shoulder just before the holidays, because their house was going into foreclosure.

The massage therapist, who has built up a nice health spa, with alternative physical and mental health practitioners. Her husband was laid off 2 years ago, then started his own small contracting business, but has had no income since the first of the year. They are behind on all their bills. They have no health insurance. She contracted pneumonia over New Years, tried to work through it, but finally had to pay for a doctor and anti-biotics.

Their income is down, because so many of their clients are out of work, or can find only part time work.

So, we are going to be laying off teachers and State workers and reducing the wages of the “essential” employees who remain. They will have less money to spend to support the “small businesses” in our town, which will have less revenue, pay fewer taxes. The State will have even less revenue, and will make more cuts and …… this will become a death spiral.

The Wisconsin workers are taking a stand. I hope they are downloading Gene Sharp’s manual.

GREAT POST!

Yes, this is clearly going to become a death spiral

So from the comments above it seems voting Democratic is better than voting for Republicans. Tryin to figure it out before 2012.

“… they can afford to pay me more because my work brings in more revenue …”

Wrong. Labor rates are based on supply and demand the same as any commodity. The labor pool for McDonalds is large. The labor pool for athletes that can hit a fastball 400 ft is small.

One of the reasons the private sector is sitting on the sidelines as the unemployment rate sits at 9.5% is because they like it that way. High unemployment increases the labor pool and suppresses wages.

Agreed, the solution isn’t to strip the public unions of traditional union powers (collective bargaining, etc…), it’s to end the unique situation of public-sector unions using union dues to determine who sits on the other side of the negotating table.

I’m pretty sure that banning public-sector union political contributions would violate Citizens United though. . .

Please do not frame this as a Republican problem. Let’s get our heads out of the sand.

The DEMS and REPUGS are the problem. They are owned by the CORPORATIONS AND BANKSTERS AND DO THEIR BIDDING. Voting for either party brings no change or hope for 95% of our country.

THEY ARE RAPING OUR COUNTRY. LAWS DO NOT APPLY TO THEM ONLY TO the “little people.”

PEOPLE OF WISCONSIN, WE ARE PROUD OF YOU. WE SHOULD BE MARCHING IN 50 STATES AND DEMANDING THAT MONEY BE TAKEN OUT OF POLITICS AND TERM LIMITS BE PUT TO A VOTE.

Labor should call for a general state wide strike involving all union members and their supporters.

I’d just like to ask one question without having cyber bricks and stones thrown at me, okay?
The question is …why is it so bad to have state workers/teachers pay taxes and health insurance premiums on a level with the private sector?

Wrong question, Creature.

It’s wrong for everyone to be paying taxes on health insurance premiums.

Put differently, why should private sector workers not get the same compensation as public sector workers.

Now that you mention it, how did that turn out? Union support from other unions didn’t seem to exist to the air traffic controllers, as everybody spouted the “can you believe how much they get paid?” line.

Damn, people are taking over the Madison state capital!

I have a question. Are there not federal labor laws involved here? I mean, it’s all fine and dandy for these assclowns to tear up legally binding contracts, but are there not federal laws? Even without, would these assclowns not have their butts handed to them in the courts for destroying a legally binding contract?

McDonalds? You are failing your argument using that as an example. That corporation makes billions and pays squat. They are the worst for paying their employees diddly but making megabillions. If your argument were to hold water, then McD’s should have been paying you roughly $40/hour because the demand was there and they’d STILL make a profit.

I didn’t present my question properly, I guess. I just wanted to know why teachers and union members feel they should be any more special in their programs than the rest of us. I still don’t think I am saying this right. Maybe I should get anothe cup of coffeee…lol

Say what you will, where were all these middle class protesters when the poor were being trampled? They didn’t care, is where they were. They thought they were more deserving and worthy, is where they were. Picked off one group at a time. It’s easy when people don’t extend themselves to others. Now it’s the middle class’ turn. Banana Republic, here we come!

Wait till you hear the howls when the vigilantes get to doctors. Next group up for “shared sacrifice.” Not to mention the Medis, care and caid. Poor first, of course.

yes

As of last night at 10 PM – not one arrest.

The problem is, these unions have actually fought for this stuff in the past and won. Then stopped. Why did they not try to get the same things for everyone? For far too long, tinkle down has happened to everyone. Unionized people were the least tinkled on. Now the political hacks have said “hey, we missed these guys!”

That vid went viral a couple weeks ago. Nice to see you’re keepin’ up.

Tweets tell me that busloads of riot police have arrived at the Capitol. People were shouting that “kids are in there”. Walker’s about to have blood on his hands.

Someone needs to get RECALL initiatives working. Even if the protesters win this particular battle and get Walker to back down on this proposal, he’ll be back tomorrow with another one. He has revealed himself to be Wisconsin’s Hosni Mubarak; he is a danger to all Wisconsinites until he is forced from office. If there are state senators working in cahoots with Hosni Walker, then they also should be subjected to recall campaigns.

Exactly what I attempted to say in post 65. LOL. Unions did so much, then stopped. Why? Would it not help their union members wages, pensions, etc, if they would have fought for everyone?

http://www.thedailypage.com/daily/article.php?article=32306

Live feed. You can comment too. Spread it around.

Looks like even tea party governors are not immune to old fashioned street protests. Not good publicity when thousands of angry public employees literally storm the state capital over your centerpiece legislative goal. Scott Walker is in trouble…

just wanted to know why teachers and union members feel they should be any more special in their programs than the rest of us. I

That’s what people said when those fucking reds demanded a 40 hour, five day work week. Imagine! Then they demanded overtime pay. Then paid sick time and vacations. People seem to forget that before unions it was a “typical” six day work week. No workplace safety rules, no paid sick time or pay for overtime. You did what the employer wanted or there were some other hungry immigrants needing a job.

Of course today, those same people going along with Fox and demanding why the union workers think they’re so special do so while taking for granted their own “right” to a 40 hour, five day work week and other things that those unions fought for and won.

Break the unions and see how long those long-established rights remain in place.

I think the only thing that’s still against the law in the United States is smoking pot and burning fake movie DVDs. That’s the only laws being enforced.

Maybe, but I think citizens are fed up with benefits given on the public dime that they don’t get. Such as in California, being able to buy 5 years of service, that you didn’t work, to add to your retirement.

This comes about from the unions being able to pay money to the campaigns of people who will in turn vote on the union contract. A clear conflict of interest that invites abuse.

Amen, brother.

Hey gang! When one Googles “wisconsin protests”, Fox crap is in the first page of search results. Let’s fix that, shall we?

Please, when blog writing or leaving comments at other sites, make sure to post links to this and other FDL posts on the topic. (I’ve gathered up a good collection of boost-worthy links here.)

Thanks for all you do!

Blekko.com is another pretty decent search engine I put on my toolbar for when I need to be sure the search I’m doing isn’t a paid ad.

This is the classic divide and conquer. Pit the public and private sector workers against each other, and ignore teh fact that the banksters and their corrupt political puppets got us into this, and not only have they not paid for the mess they created, but they go on giving themselves huge profits, and still committing fraud.

Don’t be fooled in the same way so many were fooled into thinking we had two parties, and are now waking up to the fact we have one body, two headed plutocracy.

Yeah, but I’m targeting this to the folks who aren’t web mavens. They’re the ones most likely to just settle for whatever they see on Google’s front page. Otherwise it’s a good thought.

The WI State Senate Democrats walked out to prevent a vote. Reason: lack of a quorum.

Governor “Dickhead” Walker called out the WI State Troopers to hunt them down and return them to the Senate, post haste.

They are all reportedly “out of state.”

Wrong. Labor rates are based on supply and demand the same as any commodity

You are so right. That’s why the proportion of CEO’s who are over 6 feet tall is vastly greater than the average for the male population, and why there are so few short CEO’s, and why an extra inch in height earns you something like $800 to $900 a year extra on average. There are just more short people than tall people. Everybody knows that. Supply and Demand.

“We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately.” Ben was a street smart guy. (Supported the crown until almost the last moment, BTW.) “We’ve allowed our sense of individualism to trump our sense of community.” Woman lawyer in NYC years ago on the subject of child support, lack of.

This American fixation on exceptionalism, each of us convinced of our special and righteously deserved place in the scheme of things, is killing us. One self isolated group at a time. When you make an exception for anybody’s humanity, you set a general principle of extermination.

What was that about authoritarian personalities and political preferences?

This is a really, really cool video.

http://ow.ly/3YqYR

I nominate it as the people’s video of the week.

If you don’t have a people’s video of the week… maybe start one or something.

No its is because those sports bring in huge amounts of money which allows those players to be paid such high amounts. look at professional wrestling. They are actors, they have a skill but it is replaceable as seen throughout its history. They are paid well because they can pack stadiums and arenas and bring in lots of money. Gymnastics and ballet take considerable skill but don’t they don’t earn the same as other athletes because the revenue stream for those events is not as large.

I understand your supply and demand concept and it is very inciteful but it is lacking this key element.

Wow you really must not know any McDonalds franchise owners or and resutrant owners for that matter. As a matter of fact the McDonalds by me owns and operates 17 stores and provides health insurance to its employees that mirrors what I get in my union mill job. Some basic economics and global economy classes seem in order…

Owwww…

Present, former Packers say they back AFL-CIO
By Don Walker of the Journal Sentinel
Feb. 15, 2011

Present and former members of the Green Bay Packers, all members of the National Football League Players Association, have signed a letter in support of the AFL-CIO’s efforts to derail Gov. Scott Walker’s plan to cut some union bargaining rights.

The letter was signed by Curtis Fuller, Chris Jackie, Charles Jordan, Bob Long, Steve Okoniewski, Brady Poppinga and Jason Spitz.

…that had hurt in Flyover Country.

When a state or business cannot supply the demand of the employees pay then they cease to exist because their no reason to run a business that makes no money. So yes supply and demand does play an important role but their are limits as I have tried to describe.

Um, canadianbeaver, the 8 hour day, paid vacation and sick time, workers’ comp, overtime pay. paid health insurance (ok, I know some of these are fast disappearing), were all originally Union demands. Even being paid regularly and in cash (instead of company “script”) are the result of Union demands.

In the 70′s and 80′s, Unions became the target of a concerted campaign to demonize and delegitimize them. (Well, some of their leadership helped by being not so nice about how they spent Union funds). Union membership in this country has dropped markedly – I don’t know the exact numbers off-hand, but it is a dramatic drop. This has been helped along by the large corporations, such as a well-known big-box store, that have actively discouraged Union membership among its employees.

Some might marvel at the coincidence of stagnating median income with the disappearance of Unions

In retrospect, we workers, instead of being content with our lot and feeling that we really didn’t need the Unions any more, should have fought long and fiercely to keep them in place.

Maybe it’s not too late.

… because their there is no reason to run a business that makes no money.

Except that states are not supposed to be money making. They are supposed to help provide for the common welfare of ALL, not just the richest and select few at the top.

All of the Democratic State Senators ran for the border and took 2 like minded Republicans with them and there isnt a quorum so there is NO VOTE!!!!

Thousands and thousands of demonstrators just like the good old days.

Well, before long we will all be equally screwed so it doesn’t matter what the pros and cons are now anyhow.

First they came for the union workers. Next, they come for you. Hide your wife and children. Lock your doors. Protect your tiny bit of savings.

You are the poor, the sad song of middle class never attained, facing the ghosts of medical bills and nursing homes, honor lost, dreams long parted, hope a feather dropped to the ground with no whisper of wind forever.

why is it so bad to have state workers/teachers pay taxes and health insurance premiums on a level with the private sector?

It’s not so bad. In fact, I haven’t seen or known any teachers that didn’t pay taxes and have a share of health care premiums and some teachers contribute their share toward a pension plan. What this protest is about is a new governor coming in acting like a despot in a banana republic. He appears to have arbitrarily and unilaterally decided “stripping away of collective bargaining rights for public employees” was necessary. Even if this governor wins, I would see it as a loss for his state. Why? They’ll lose some of the best teachers over this, and the ones they lose will likely be the cream of the crop. The taxpayers that continue to send their children to public schools, then, will end up with discount store teachers. It’s hard to judge what will happen to public education when you treat your teachers like unskilled workers instead of like professionals. Whoever can afford it will send their kids to private schools, which is pretty much what the Republicans want anyway.

Unfortunately, most folks cannot afford private schools; they’re too busy trying to survive. So if they degrade the schools by undercutting teachers salaries, by letting the buildings fall apart due to deferred maintenance, etc., they will degrade the quality of students. That is, we will have many, many citizens with lots of unrealized potential, or worse yet, that potential gets channeled into the wrong path. Regardless, many individuals will not be equipped to function well in society and our economy will continue to roll like a snowball in a downward spiral of deflation: the exact opposite of the upward spiral of inflation Reagan fought. And all because Republicans wanted to run public schools on the cheap.

And here I always thought the role of the state was to balance the demands of the market against the common weal. Didn’t ever imagine that was a business in itself. Still don’t, actually. Corporate autocracy is still tyranny, whatever formal pol sci label it carries.

I don’t know if anyone on here cares, but I’d like to thank the people that take the time to post comments in such a civil way. I am serious. There is so much viciousness on other sites that it sometimes takes one’s breath away. And I am talking about responses to just a simple question or comment. So, again, people, you are appreciated big time…

I care and I share your sentiment. It’s nice to be able to post comments and be treated like a fellow human being. :)