There has been more momentum toward the bin Laden death leading to an exit from our occupation of Afghanistan than I expected. I expected more hesitancy from typically cautious Democrats around this point. But here’s Barney Frank making an argument:
Explaining his decision to vote for the Afghanistan war in 2001, Frank said, “We went there to get Osama bin Laden. And we have now gotten Osama bin Laden. … So yes, I think this does strengthen the case [for withdrawal].” [...]
“Look, part of the argument against this reduction is that it was reputational, for staying in Afghanistan. ‘We can’t look like America was driven out.’ ‘We can’t go away with our tail between our legs.’ All of those metaphors. Well, we just killed Osama bin Laden, and I think that takes a lot of the pressure away — a lot of the punch away from the argument that ‘oh, it will look like we walked away.’”
And more surprising to me, Senate Armed Services Committee Chair Carl Levin made the argument as well:
In Levin’s own words, “Afghans now are in an even better position to take responsibility, because whatever direction is coming from Pakistan, from that safe haven, no longer has the guidance, whatever strength bin Laden’s presence or direction could give to it.
“That’s now weakened. So the potential of the Afghan army and police to take responsibility is greater now and the fear that, gee whiz can they do it on their own, is something which now is of lesser concern, because the direction, the strength, the leadership of bin Laden and al Qaeda from that safe haven in Pakistan is severely weakened, and that should strengthen the hand of the Afghan security forces….
“I don’t think there was day-to-day control at all. What there was was this idea that somehow or other that the messages that come from across the border to die for the cause have that mystique behind those messages, when they’re given to those young people who are committing suicide. That’s gone. Now, there’ll be a substitute mystique which will be attempted and I don’t want to be naive at all about the fact that there may be — probably will be — an increase in suicide bombers as a kind of retaliation…but in terms of there being any more there in some sense guiding — a guiding hand — is now gone. It won’t be long before that settles in.”
This is pretty brazen on the part of typically more circumspect lawmakers. But they’re both talking about the same thing: all of the weird protocols and mythologies that accompanied bin Laden are really gone now. You strip that away and you’re left with nothing but a nation-building experiment in a nation that doesn’t really welcome our help to the same degree anymore.
The “substitute mystique” is already being built by conservatives who don’t want us to leave basically any battlefield. But the whole “cut and run” narrative that they will gin up in response is badly undermined by the reality of bin Laden’s death and even more so the location of it. Chris Hitchens’ early call for some kind of reckoning with Pakistan might be their next move. But that has little to do with Afghanistan, and our reason for continuing with 150,000 troops in a war that cannot be won.
What’s more, the fact that bin Laden was found in a medium-sized, relatively modern city in Pakistan should end once and for all the argument that we have to deny safe havens in Afghanistan. As Matt Yglesias says:
On the one hand, no location on earth is actually safe from a United States military capable of deploying special operations troops and a wide array of deadly airborne munitions. On the other hand, people can hide out in all kinds of places. It didn’t take a remote cave or a super-villain lair, it just took discipline. Trying to physical conquer and occupy territory in order to prevent it from being used by terrorists is extremely difficult, oftentimes counterproductive, unnecessary, and offers no guarantee of success.
And the safe haven myth has frequently been cited by the Administration as the central reason for the war effort.
Obama has a major leadership moment, and it’s coming as soon as July. We can end the mindset of the war on terror that impelled us into multiple wars of choice, and we can embark on a new partnership with the democratic soul of the Muslim world, seeking to break free after decades of silence.





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This really is the perfect time for Obama to declare ‘victory’ in a conflict in which he would otherwise not have the opportunity to do so, and get out.
The stated mission was to get OBL. OBL been got. Time to get the feck outta Dodge since “Mission Accomplished”
It’s to Frank’s and Levin’s credit for speaking up, even if they are 10 years and a few trillion dollars short.
Troops
Home
Now
Karzai may be crazy by now, but TPM said he’s saying the same thing
Several congresscritters were already showing signs of this. Friday, Jim Himes (D-CT) had publicly said “I’m done” with supporting the war in Afghanistan. There will be a bunch more joining him now.
Now that’s political courage. And this, from Glennzilla:
Unsung heroes: The Donald and Michelle Bachman. Too often we at FDL make fun of the irascible Donald; yet, without his important participation this operation may well have failed. Howso?
Well, look at the timeline of events. An evil-doer might well have concluded that the POTUS was up to something if he appeared worried and haggard — from planning this momentous matter.
Instead, THE DONALD and MB gave the President cover by persisting with the wingnut birther buzz. Surely evil-doers everywhere must have felt complacent that the POTUS was pre-occupied by the regular sideshow nuttery raised by the crazed tea-baggers: gawdblessum!
Further, THE DONALD shows great restraint in not singing his own praises that he deflected the enemy from important matters with his birther and college admission smokescreen. Ditto teleprompter Michelle B.
Thanks also to the MSM who went along with the charade by focusing on birtherism these last few weeks. Otherwise, they may well have spoiled the operation by shining a light on more important matters! (Engage snark button here.)
When you cite troop numbers, it would be helpful also to cite contractor numbers, too. They often double the number of personnel promoting a policy and quadruple the price. Withdrawing troops but not contractors would be away to get credit for something you’re not really doing.
That makes it worth frequently reminding people about their presence, in addition to and apart from our “troops”.
Protect the Troops! Bring them home.
Yes, in spades. Nor do we need thousands of troops and contractors to eradicate (or cultivate) poppy fields, to train police or effectively to persuade a local population that despite our weapons and drones and mistaken targets, we are there to help them.
Petitions to bring the troop home now!
Rethink Afghanistan
Bin Laden’s Death: Time to Rein in Empire
If Obama withdraws forces from Afghanistan, he will wait a few more months, to get maximum benefit for the 2012 elections. I expect the withdraw to begin (if it happens at all) around November of this year.
Wins: START and death of OBL.
Losses: too many to count
Remember the newly installed Obama threatening Democratic legislators that they would be dead to him if they didn’t support his warmongering?
The chain will get yanked on this right quick. And Barney Frank can treat us to an explanation of how he “expressed himself poorly”.
And Levin as well.
I think it’s going to be harder for Obama to do that now. Even before yesterday’s raid, Jim Himes had already said he was “done” with backing further fighting in Afghanistan. If a corporatist Goldman Sachs exec turned congresscritter like Himes, a guy who’s not known for sticking his neck out, was already turning against the Afghanistan war even before OBL’s death (which as it turned out occurred in Pakistan where OBL had been living safely since 2005), then I imagine more will soon join him in calling for a pullout.
Maybe the whole point of this exercise was for obama to give himself an easy point to leave AfPak.
Maybe it wasn’t a dream I posted on Peterr’s thread.
“I fell asleep waiting for the announcement and had a dream last night.
The President announced the death and said that ordering this extra-judicial killing had caused him to seriously reconsider his War on Terror and that he wanted to have a national fireside chat on priorities.
That he was ordering an immediate end to drone attacks.Halting our aggression in Libya. Withdrawing from Afghanistan and Iraq. And devoting those savings as well as taxing the rich to make the American Dream real again”
On the other hand, when have Congressional leaders stood up for anything of value in the last ten years?
Thanks for the links, petitions signed.
Declare victory and bring those troops home!
Thanks DDay.
Also, appreciate you correctly calling it an “occupation.”
Troops
Home
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Once Obama became POTUS, suddenly, a lot of wingnuts re-discovered old-time conservative, isolationism.
Tough to get funding for an occupation of a country that doesn’t have any oil when Paul Ryan and the GOP Governors are singing “we’re broke,” in three-part harmony.
Thanks for bringing up the issue about not just the number of troops, but also the vast great number of contractors that you and I are paying for in Iraq, Afghanistan & Pakistan (and coming soon, no doubt, to Libya).
I’m all for bringing home the troops and keeping them safer than they are now. I’m also all for bringing home those contractors and stopping my tax dollah$ from going directly into Dick Cheney’s pocket.
Good luck to any pols who propose getting out of Afghanistan (at least). I won’t hold my breath, but I’d love to see it happen.
More likely that killing Osama Bin Laden will soften us all up for taking out the rest of the Gaddafi family.
No one is mentioning the funeral of Gaddafi’s youngest son today or anything else that is going on, such as London, Turkey, etc. cutting all diplomatic ties with Libya. The death of Bin Laden will condition us to accept NATO taking out elected state leaders (not that everyone even recognizes the distinction). Highly convenient time to stumble across Bin Laden’s whereabouts.
If anyone is on high alert today, it should be democratically elected leaders of countries south of us —– the taste of blood can get addictive.
Barney Frank. You are joking?
Kerry, too. He’s calling for hearings regarding an endgame in Afghanistan. May he prevail!
Fuggetaboutit–Obama is full of too much hubris and craven ambition to even consider leaving Afghanistan. Until the American people get into the streets, we will be there for the foreseeable future. War pays for the machine and people like Obama.
Welcome to the party, dumbasses. Better late than never, right?