House Speaker John Boehner has retooled his bill and submitted it to CBO, and CBO responded by affirming that it would cut the deficit by $917 billion over the next decade, along with setting up a process for another $1.8 trillion through a Catfood Commission II. Boehner didn’t actually do much to get this number, a slight increase from the $850 billion score of the previous bill. Here’s how CBO describes it:
The amendment proposed on July 27, 2011, would modify the legislation proposed on July 25, 2011, by eliminating caps on discretionary outlays for fiscal years 2012 and 2013. The amendment also would make minor modifications to the procedures related to further increases in the debt limit.
Compared with the version of the Budget Control Act of 2011 proposed on July 25, CBO estimates that eliminating the outlay caps for 2012 and 2013 (that were contained in that proposal) would lead to outlays that are about $45 billion lower over the 2012-2021 period. (The resulting reduction in debt service costs would increase the total reduction in outlays to about $65 billion over the 10-year period.) CBO had assumed that the outlay caps would effectively set a target for discretionary spending; that target was greater than the outlays that CBO would normally estimate by applying average aggregate rates of spending to the reduction in discretionary budget authority specified for each year. Therefore, without such caps, the effect of the proposed reductions in budget authority would be more pronounced.
That goes pretty deep into wonk-land, but basically we’re talking about changing how the outlays would hit, rather than the budgetary authority. This leads to a $22 billion reduction in spending in fiscal year 2012, compared to… $24 billion, in the Harry Reid plan. So if anything, the changes by Boehner bring it more into line with Reid’s plan, which initially cut more up front than Boehner in the discretionary budget, while spending a bit more in the mandatory budget.
With Boehner’s office hyping the changes and virtually the entire Republican establishment coming aboard for the plan at the last minute, I’d say that Boehner’s plan will sneak through the House tomorrow.
But it will stop there. In a late-in-the-day release, the entire Democratic caucus in the Senate has written a letter to the Speaker saying they will not vote for his plan when it comes to their chamber.
With five days until our nation faces an unprecedented financial crisis, we need to work together to ensure that our nation does not default on our obligations for the first time in our history. We heard that in your caucus you said the Senate will support your bill. We are writing to tell you that we will not support it, and give you the reasons why.
A short-term extension like the one in your bill would put America at risk, along with every family and business in it. Your approach would force us once again to face the threat of default in five or six short months. Every day, another expert warns us that your short-term approach could be nearly as disastrous as a default and would lead to a downgrade in our credit rating. If our credit is downgraded, it would cost us billions of dollars more in interest payments on our existing debt and drive up our deficit. Even more worrisome, a downgrade would spike interest rates, making everything from mortgages, car loans and credit cards more expensive for families and businesses nationwide.
In addition to risking a downgrade and catastrophic default, we are concerned that in five or six months, the House will once again hold the economy captive and refuse to avoid another default unless we accept unbalanced, deep cuts to programs like Medicare and Social Security, without asking anything of the wealthiest Americans.
We now have only five days left to act. The entire world is watching Congress. We need to do the right thing to solve this problem. We must work together to avoid a default the responsible way – not in a way that will do America more harm than good.
The Senate Dems are careful to lay out really the only objection, the only actual difference, between the Reid and Boehner bills: one raises the debt limit by $2.7 trillion up front, and the other only raises it by $1 trillion. That’s it. Boehner’s plan can’t pass the Senate and has drawn a veto threat. Reid’s plan can probably get a majority in the Senate, but might not be able to clear a filibuster. In the House, it would probably get a lot of Democratic support, but Boehner wouldn’t bring it to the floor in its current form.
We are literally on the verge of running out of cash at the Treasury over a timing issue on increasing the debt limit.
Ladies and gentlemen, your 112th Congress.
…House Democrats, meanwhile, are uniting around a clean bill, which has over 100 co-sponsors, and is rising. But that’s so deeply unserious!
…I think Ezra gets the numbers wrong here, I thought the payroll tax cut was only about $120 billion, not $160 billion (confirmed, it was $112B). But he’s right that, under the Boehner plan, fiscal policy would contract by at least $200 billion (and $250 billion if his numbers are right) in 2012. According to the IMF, that would lead to a reduction of 0.5% of GDP and an increase of 0.3% in unemployment. And it’s the same for the Reid plan.



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“According to the IMF, that would lead to a reduction of 0.5% of GDP and an increase of 0.3% in unemployment. And it’s the same for the Reid plan.”; and this doesn’t faze the politicians?
I’m confused. Can you please reconcile the following two statements?
and
Is there a any way for the Senate to shut down the House?
What are they thinking?
“Interestingly enough, the President has the power to call Congress into extra or special sessions. While this has been done on many occasions, no President has yet to exercise his constitutional right to adjourn Congress. This power may be exercised only in the event of a disagreement between the two houses on the subject of adjournment.”
Might be the best option; have the Senate adjourn,House reject or vice versa and then the Prez can issue an executive order re gummint finances.
But such won’t happen.
They’re not thinking; sending you an email that shows how the politicos are operating about finances.
When we have a President who considers caving and capitulation to the enemy as “compromise”, to whom taking a strong stand by taking the fight to the enemy is totally alien, then the country can and will be run into a ditch at some point. Looks like such a point is coming up fast.
Cheap Labor and Starve the Beast.
Given that we have, reportedly, a government “of the people, for the people, and for the people,” it looks like Grover and his acolytes want to starve us the people to death or at least weak enough to drown in a bathtub.
Those will be the positive, negative signals to boost the confidence that markets and businesses need to expand.
Gentle reminder: Obama is not caving; he’s doing what he wants to do.
He wants that Super Congress of 12 Caesars in order to cut/gut SocSec/MM.
It’s his goal. It’s his homage to St. Ronnie, who was unable to budge SocSec and Medicare.
Why? Bcz he’s a conservative.
DDay
It must be so awful for you to have to track every minute of this deal – not deal.
Not Snark.
David Plouffe on NewsHour tonight, in response to a question from Gwen Ifill about whether Obama would consider a constitutional option concerning raising the debt ceiling:
Okaaaaaayy, then. Cut off your options. Good move, Barry.
Just how clean is the demodogs bill? I’m really wondering why I would trust them to do anything right thing for the citizens of this nation or the world for that matter and I don’t since McGovern. Main Street loses in the end and 0 friends win.
Everyting is on schedule, please move along.
Voting Green, It has to happen some time?
He’s a maniac.
It would appear IMO that the Republicans are determined to bring the country to its knees and that this default will happen now or later but is coming down the track. Anyone agree with me?
They are already blowing up the economy. We just kind of ran out of work today and there’s nothing in the pipe. Everybody is holding their breath and sitting on their money, even more so than before. The Beltway folks are just fucking cluelessly playing, (badly), while the USS Shipofstate sinks.
But what does he know? Ob has shown lots of evidence of doing what he wants to do.
I think the establishment Rs may have been successful at turning away from that outcome — maybe only temporarily, as you suggest. I think we’re in for a short extension. Can’t see the Rs giving Obama a clean increase through 2013. That would seem politically stupid — for them, I mean.
YMMV
Sure.
Based on reports, S&P would downgrade US debt under a short-term plan like Boehner’s. They would not under a longer-term plan, at least according to these reports. So “six months later” refers to the trigger for the second tranche of the debt limit increase in the Boehner plan, tied to the Catfood Commission II recommendations being adopted.
Thanks. That’s what I thought you meant. I was looking at the politics. The major difference between the two is the length of the extension, or however it should be described. I think a short term extension is politically deadly to Obama. But YMMV
Also, my guess is that might have been the initial trigger to get the rating agencies involved.
This whole thing completely sux. I have burned an inordinate amount of mental energy this week trying to decide whether I should massively load up supplies at CostCo, make a big ATM withdrawal, and top off the gas tank.
Does that suggest that we are going to be hearing this struggle for the next 6 months? Nightmare…
The Repu’ublicist “two step” proposal is simply, transparently all about Necklacing Obama for 2012.
Yes, it is drama, comedy, farce, disaster.
He seems to use McCardle Math. But who has the 16 Trillion Dollars that the Federal Reserve donated to Bankers everywhere?
Whatever plan the President and the Catfoodies choose, I will call it the BFDD, Big Fucking Debt Deal.
John Dean wrote 10 years ago that the neo-con’s grand plan was to raise the deficit to the point that it would be politically unsustainable and they could then gut the new deal safety net. They started on this plan by cutting taxes, invading Iraq (seizing Iraqi oil wells was a nice little side benefit) and passing an unfunded medicare prescription drug benefit. Then they tanked the economy by looking the other way while wall street raided every pension fund in the country, thereby decimating tax revenues.
ps. for all you liberals that fawned over Obama when Hillary Clinton would have done just fine, how’s it feel to be betrayed?
I’m confused why any one would care about any rating corp. or ws whore would have to say since they helped Amerika get to this point as they did in the rest of the world? This just playes into the hands of the elite!
reids plans ids different and still kills Masin Street only slower, Oh my dog I feel better.
Please think take time to think about this?
Everything is on schedule, please move along.
Yes. What is the interesting question — perhaps just academic at this point — is whether progressives should want Obama to have a shorter or longer extension? Given the existence of Catfood II.
I understand that having the approval of the second tranche dependent on Catfood II makes passage of their “recommendations” more likely. But passage may be inevitable, no? Does a long term extension buy US anything?
My guess is that Obama feels it is FAR more preferable.
According to one explanation I read among the blogs (maybe at FDL I can’t remember) but according to the way the US banking and monetary system works, the only way this debt ceiling thing could have practical disastrous consequences for people is if the NY Federal Reserve were to not honor the US’s “overdraft” by sending out checks there wasn’t cash on hand to cover. Is Obama going to tell some underling “don’t send out those Social Security checks or Veterans benefit checks next week or we’ll be overdrawn at the bank?” Is Obama going to fire someone who signs his or er name to T-bills or T-bonds going out to the Federal Reserve because they went over the “debt limit”?
There is an air of total make-believe about this “crisis” which seems to have only political and not real life consequences. Of course we should obey the law, but if Congress cannot fix this, then practical people in government (I’m talking to you, Mr. President) have to solve the problem with the tools at hand. What gives this “debt ceiling” the force and effect of law that makes seen the discussion of default credible?
Let’s say the President or his Treasury man were to authorize the issue of debt over the limit. Is that a “high crime or misdemeanor”? Could he be impeached? Oli North and John Poindexter and whole bunch of other people brazenly defied a Congressional resolution under Reagan not to supply the contras with weapons. They lied and were convicted. In the end they almost all got away with it. If the President’s men can defy Congress on something like the contras and get away with it, what’s stopping anybody here?
The spectacle of this sausage making and wonkery are getting over the top IMHO. I think the country’s getting a bit overinvolved with make-believe here to the point where we are in danger of losing our grip on reality.
My wife and I caucused for Hillary. There were two subsequent words dictating my eventual vote for Obama: “Sarah Palin.”
Would “Joe Lieberman” have changed your mind?
I don’t recall and no longer care. What’s done is done.
Look guys the rich control DC. Always have. This is nothing new. Get that, and maybe we can start working towards a solution.
Even with all this info you still think hillary would have been different. They are all the same. wake up. BTW iraq oil is mainly going to china.
You know you are reaching Bizzaro World when John Grampy McCain starts doing snark, against Teabaggers.
That is funny, Teabagging Hobbits.
McGrampy is for the Boner Plan, “A Boner In Every Home”.
A) I was a Clinton supporter during the primaries, (though she wasn’t my first choice either).
B) Don’t you think the time for PUMA spawned “I told ya so”s is past? It’s not helpful.
And a two-tranch cornhole for Barry.
Bill Champlin nailed it in 1996 (mp3).
The good old GOP; always looking for the price point where they can fuck nebbout everybody but the rich, and have juuust enough bottom-feeding amurkans who’ll call it “sound fiscal policy”, to get away with it.
Pretty good job…you gotta admit.
Of course, this time they (with lots of help from Barack Obama…)are doing it not too long after they got the living shit kicked out of them in the preznintial election.
Good post, Margaret, where it’s really not helpful is to the person ignorant and/or dishonest enough to say:
“You guys really fucked up by not picking the candidate who was UNSPINNABLY on board for bush’s clusterfucks for nearly 5 years, until she saw it ruining her chance at the white house. At which point, she stopped giving glute-rubs to the american right, sorta-kinda, at least on that point. Why weren’t you people perceptive enough to vote for the democrat who supported Joe Lieberman against a good anti-war opponent, and in the primary fight, praised John McCain as making a better commander-in-chief than Obama?”
“Anyone agree with me?”
Sort of, Twain.
The repubs are clearly willing to tank the economy as a means to get at Obama. Having him voluntarily spreadeagled over the railing of the House of the United States chamber evidently isn’t enough for them; they want to hear him beg for it.
Their problem is that they have to do it incrementally. If Boehner figuratively goes prancing down Pennsylvania Avenue whle juggling Obama’s political nads, as the GOP congressionals hold happy-time tea-parties with the wingnuts, it could backfire on them some.
I mean, they’ve already got him in a straight jacket. They shouldn’t be greedy.
Anyone who disagrees, please tell us how he’s going to turn this economic shit around.
Ir far transcends his being a conservative.
Try fascist, in servitude to the fascist corporatists.
Hey Demi . .
Heck of a point . . . can’t imagine what David, Jon and Mz Hamsher go thru daily hearing and learning all the bad news they share with us.
Gotta be hard on them . . . so, bless them one and all and thank you!
Half agree . . . I’m of the belief both the dims and the thugs are in this and led by the same lobby’s and corporate overlords.
There is just NO DIFFERENCE between the party’s, nor the politicians.
They are ALL bought and sold . . . so is our system of governence.
It’s a total failure.
It’s corporate fascism no different than Italy and Germany of the late 20′s n 30′s.
Shit, sorry to hear this.
I’m still lookin . . . little hope . . .
So basically, S&P is FORCING our governing system to cut public service programs and SS, SS which WE paid into with the employer’s congtribution, also . . . n S&P wants to gut that.
Shift of wealth, get that trust fund in the hands of the privateers. They can bet against it in the meantime and make their killings, I’m sure.
There is no trigger . . . the dims, thugs, and ratings agencies, bankers, financiers and Wall St are doing the same thing they did with housing mortgages . . . there is no leader except for the coalition of elite who drive it all.
No difference than Milken Junk Bonds, Enron, CA energy theft, etc.
Legislated, deregulated legal theft of the wealth of the masses.
Fascism.
No it’s not, that’s the false meme, don’t buy the kabuki yer fed.
The trick pony is to either gut SS and public service programs, or, at least get the Super Committee enacted so IT can gut us.
Do not follow the MSM status quo glitter . . . .
Well, HRC and Obama play for the same overlords the neocons play for, so I just don’t get the validity of yer point.
Nice try, ‘Bot.
They are all bought and sold . . . owned by the oligarchy.
You been out of country for a while have ya . . . . Mt. Everest maybe?
Yep, other than US v. THEM, there are no sides.
It’s we the people v the corporate fascists, one and all.
N so far, they own and operate every facet of our nation, and our lives.
SURE Obama wants the long term . . . he thinks it keeps us off his throat, or the throat of the elites . . . for a while.
The longer Obama or any of them elites can stave us off, it just keeps us from hitting the streets . . . . the rest is a game to deceive the less informed masses.
You know this, yer as sharp as anyone on this rock. ;-)
It’s just using Puma Spawn for an angle . . . known centrist and confrontationist troller Margaret . . . ;-)
KIllin me, I’ve still got Sons Of Champlain, and The Sons, on vinyl.
I MIGHT have seen The Sons at Winterland or Fillmore, but don’t recall. Wasn’t till mid 70′s I really got into them.
*G*
Nice memory lane hit, thanks . . .
Say! How’d you embed an mp3?
I wanna learn!!!!
*G*
Tan my dear friend (said in his best Molinari voice) they do it with the complicity and full cooperation of The Dims . . . top to bottom.
;-)
Tan you PUMA destroyer you . . . yer still the best reality show winner on the toobz!
*G*
I disagree hoss!
*G*
He don’t care!
THey don’t care!
They are all in on it . . . it’s long past any semblance of party control of congress or the executive.
They is all bought n sold to the same overlords hoss, you know this.
Course, I never heard ya SAY it to me . . . ;-)
I DO recall ‘SHITMIRE” though! Yer original!
*G*
Dayum, even Tan’s gone . .
LeSigh.
You probably won’t see this given #56 but come on Larue, you can see how he ‘embedded’ the mp3, know you can.
Didn’t know you were looking for work so drop by where I’m commenting or a diary I write and tell me what you do for the legal tender.
And I’ll have to disagree with RFK; afaic, the Sons said it all in 1969
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The incompetence of obama has doomed the country to second rate status. This guy is a f@@@king idiot. This is the best the Democrats can come up with?
I believe Reids plan was at the request of Obummer. First Reid was against any cuts to the big 3, then he had meetings with obummer and came up with this plan that screws over the big 3 like obummer wanted. Wishful thinking I know, but I would like to see both parties kill each others plan and throw the whole damn mess in obummers lap. after all he is the wussy that has refused to stand on his on two feet and has constantly moaned about how they wouldn’t deal with him. Adult in the room, my ass. Adults have the ability to stand on their own two feet and make decisions and them take the praise or heat for that decision. You Mr. President, are not adult!
Does being second rate mean we can stop being an empire?
Does it mean we can stop being exceptional?
Does it mean we can say okay, we’re second but we try harder?
Does it mean everyone will like us better?
Does it mean we’re not allowed to have bases in other people’s countries any longer?
And does it mean, yes, I should stock up on dried beans tomorrow? (Think I will do that anyway. Just in case. You never know. It’s that CEO uncertainty, catching I guess.)
Now who will score the net economic effect of these figures? How will this further the housing bubble? How will this affect our nation’s supply chain? And then, as the unemployment grows and consumer confidence drops further, how will the economy grow? Will it not fail? How will tax revenues drop from the high unemployment, causing further economic crisis? How will the country deal with the rise in the crime rate as the economy worsens when the country has cut fire and police to a non functioning non per capita rate? And what the hell will business tax breaks do for anyone then? Nothing. No investment in jobs.
And we will be the most inhumane country in the world by stealing from the elderly (SS, Medicaid, Medicare) and watching the elderly, former middle class and poor starve to death.
Nice. Real nice.
S & P you are the creator of this spiral of violence. And you call your actions free speech. Like h—.
Let me put my questions another way…
•Economic inequality from systemic predatory practices of an uncontrolled financial sector, causes family disruption and increases violence.
•A downward spiral of state decay and economic decline generates widespread shortages and shrinking incomes which increases violence.
•These current political practices will lead to corroding rational legal and bureaucratic practices and further misallocation of much needed public resources and lower aggrgate total factor productivity, further destroying the economy.
•This will result in a downward spiral of political and economic decline which becomes difficult to reverse.
•The nation ends up at risk of falling into economic stagnation and creating political disempowerment.