As I mentioned earlier, even a policy of taxing the wealthy is sub-optimal at this point compared to borrowing cheaply to create jobs by expanding fiscal policy. That’s not to say it’s always and forever sub-optimal. First, the rich park their money rather than spending it, so if you’re going to pay for job-creating measures, taxation on people who can afford it and who won’t scale back their own spending to the degree of others is the best way to do it. More important, the political economy has tilted massively in favor of the rich in this country. Tax policy that favors the rich, then, has an enormous impact on public policy, with everything run through corporate and wealthy elites. In an impressive rant, Steven Pearlstein shows how this worked, with the rich creating the conservative monster and financing the radical movement which has relentlessly pushed the economy to the brink of disaster. So there’s definitely value in progressive taxation, even if that may not be true at this particular point in time. And when forced to choose between progressive taxation and spending cuts, it’s really no contest.
That’s why it’s so important for Warren Buffett to speak up today in the New York Times:
Our leaders have asked for “shared sacrifice.” But when they did the asking, they spared me. I checked with my mega-rich friends to learn what pain they were expecting. They, too, were left untouched.
While the poor and middle class fight for us in Afghanistan, and while most Americans struggle to make ends meet, we mega-rich continue to get our extraordinary tax breaks. Some of us are investment managers who earn billions from our daily labors but are allowed to classify our income as “carried interest,” thereby getting a bargain 15 percent tax rate. Others own stock index futures for 10 minutes and have 60 percent of their gain taxed at 15 percent, as if they’d been long-term investors.
These and other blessings are showered upon us by legislators in Washington who feel compelled to protect us, much as if we were spotted owls or some other endangered species. It’s nice to have friends in high places.
Buffett is not so naive to think that the super-rich have no say in the matter. Maybe he’s not out there demanding low tax rates, but I don’t think all of his class compatriots are that hands-off. Maybe there’s part of it where legislators bestow these gifts pre-emptively in the hopes of big campaign contributions, but I don’t think the rich are shy about advocating for themselves.
Buffett’s critique is familiar. America taxes work and not wealth, consumption and not production, the middle class and not the rich. He blows away the facile idea that the rich stop investing when their tax rates are high. He displays all the facts about inequality and the gradually cascading tax rate for the wealthy, facts that you don’t often see coming from a member of that American aristocracy. He closes by saying “My friends and I have been coddled long enough by a billionaire-friendly Congress.”
He’s right. And since the solutions of the Catfood Commission wouldn’t take effect until 2013, as would the expiration of the Bush tax cuts (which are massively tilted toward the rich), we have the opportunity to rework the tax code without harming the recovery in the next 17 months. It’s a path unlikely to be taken. But maybe someone will listen to Warren Buffett.



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Dear Mr. Buffet there is no excuse if you feel that you don’t pay enough taxes.The government has another useless agency to handle your contributions.It is called Dept.G. I suggest you pay enough extra to cover my taxes so I can ask for a refund.Thanking you in advance but I won’t hold my breath.What we need is a consumption tax. The more you consume the more taxes you pay. No exemptions for anyone.Problem solved as everyone has skin in the game.
For your information Mr. Buffet, Bureau of the Public Debt has 4000 employees with an annual budget of 400 million.Address:Dept G,Bureau of the Public Debt,P.O.Box 2188, Parkersburg,WV 26106-2188.Now you have no excuse or anyone else that feels they don’t pay enough in taxes.Have at it.They take cash, checks or money orders.
Warren’s OpEd is not all peaches-and-cream. Later in the OpEd he writes:
[Emphases added]
He’s a Catfooder.
Raising the age old Q of whether lip service is better than no service at all.
Kelly is correct, this thing is not to be trusted.
It’s easy to say these things now, but if taxation ever went back to being fair (will NEVER happen), then he will be on the ramparts for his side, defending greed.
When a multimillionaire starts talking about how he wants to pay MORE in taxes, then usually is a hidden trap door. Buffett’s is that he wants to scrub the budget so that he can make a killing in investment bonds…and he’s no friend of entitlements, either.
Sorry, but he is as much a part of the problem as is any other mooching billionaire. Tax his butt, too.
Anthony
A consumption tax negatively impacts retirees.
warren has the right sentiment but doesn’t quite nail the correct reasoning.
here’s the real case for progressive taxation, it’s the reason progressive taxation was created in the first place but nobody (but me and a few others) are pointing this out;
my friend just took a job in manhatten because it’s the only job he can find and he needs to take what he gets, it pays 500 per week
there is a 5 dollar each way tunnel tax, that’s 10 dollars a day, five days a week, that’s 50 bucks and THAT is 10 percent of his salary
the same person making 5000 dollars a week is paying 1 percent of his salary
THAT’S what most taxes are, REGRESSIVE and the labor class pays at a FAR higher rate then the wealth class
let’s look further
if I make 50 grand or less I spend my entire salary on retaxable goods, thinks like sales and local taxes.
some people make so much they only spend 10 percent of their income on retaxable goods, that means I am paying 10 times the rate that they are paying on retaxable goods.
THAT was the purpose of progressive taxation, to equalize the tax burden and THAT is the correct case, we want them paying the same as us NOT LESS and that’s the point that warren didn’t quite make
see my 8, it demonstrates why consumption taxes are regressive
Billionaires that run corporations do not increase profits by lowering their own incomes (i.e.pay more taxes), they do so by cutting costs such as the number of employees on the payroll. Then they increase their pay through bonuses.
It’s part of the psychoses that too much money causes.
Shhhhhhh. That’s supposed to be a secret.
perris wrote: THAT’S what most taxes are, REGRESSIVE and the labor class pays at a FAR higher rate then the wealth class
let’s look further
if I make 50 grand or less I spend my entire salary on retaxable goods, thinks like sales and local taxes.
some people make so much they only spend 10 percent of their income on retaxable goods, that means I am paying 10 times the rate that they are paying on retaxable goods.
—————————–
Dude, you and JJ are really spilling the beans. I hope the billionaires don;t send a black ops sqaud after you guys.:-)
You know things are extremely screwy when rich people beg to be taxed more.
Whenever a member of the wealthy class strays from the reservation and suggests that the wealthy class should shoulder its weight by paying a fair share of taxes, defenders of the plutocrats, like alces here, use this same silly argument, that if he thinks the rich should pay more, then they should just go ahead and pay more, regardless of the tax rates.
Buffet is saying that all rich people should pay their fair share. For him to pay above the current tax rates when others in the wealthy class aren’t would put him at a competitive disadvantage to them. He is more than happy to pay his fair share if other billionaires also do so.
But have it your way. I hope you enjoy the descent into barbarism that the policies you support are causing.
And don’t forget the fines and tickets. Parking tickets are at least a hundred dollars. A friend, who is disabled, forgot to put her disability plate on the dashboard and got a $450 ticket. She lives on $850 a month. She is going to appeal it.
Suddenly, my little city of Rancho Cordova is very interested in the number of pets people have so they can fine those without the proper vaccines. This is not out of their interest for the public good. I know this because most of the city council and the mayor are repugs.
A little OT but I have to get this off my chest. I just talked to a new mechanic I took my car to this morning. I was a bit afraid when heard a Christain station playing loudly on the radio.
Then, the dude calls and tells me what’s wrong with my car and gets into a right wing political rant that must have come from Limbaugh.
Said the amount of Gulf spill oil was comparable to a thimbleful in a football stadium…that they can’t find the oil….. because there isn’t any, I guess.
It’s NOT the banks and big business, it’s Obama’s “socialist government”….
NOT the rich…..
Regulation is putting him out of business.
Mentioned “Barney “FAG”.
Really way out rightie
I really haven’t run into somebody like this in a while and I was shocked at how well the propaganda is working with some people.
They really don’t think the problem is anywhere but government, and while I have to agree with them to an extent, it’s not the same problem I’M thinking of and seeing.
I hope I don’t have to go see him very often.
It takes a real zealot to engage his customers politically. I find it’s best to stay away from the whole thing with mine.
Too bad, I think he’s a really good mechanic. I’ll have to try to stay away from issues with him and concentrate on the car.
By the way, I didn’t start it, for once.
They’re out there. And they’ll go for Perry if they get the chance. Meanwhile they’ll get poorer and poorer and more and more PO’d
Luke 12:48 “….Everyone to whom much was given, of him much will be required, and from him to whom they entrusted much, they will demand the more.”
FWIW, the Koch brothers are like most of the super-rich, the bulk of it came from inheritance. AFAIK, the oracle of Omaha on the other hand did most of it the old-fashioned way. He was just flat out better than the other sharks on Wall Street.
That’s happened to me. she can just show them the placard and they’ll cancel it. Tell her not to sweat it.
I think she can even send them a copy of it.
good to know. Thanks.
Why Working Class Baggers Hate Taxes
By claiming to be immune from federal taxation, Baggers lay bare their emotional disdain for a nation they see as increasingly foreign as the information age makes people in Mississippi and Tennessee aware of what goes on in New York and San Francisco. And it cannot be a coincidence that teabaggery found its stride during the ascendency of a black man to the White House. “I won’t pay your stinkin’ taxes” is just shorthand for “I’m not part of this country anymore.”
Article:
Why Baggers Hate Taxes
Maybe you should take your business elsewhere. Then, drop him a little note, add some actual facts to it. It won’t do any good in terms of changing his mind but he is being very inappropriate.
Warren Buffett is a crony capitalist. Anything he says or does is a direct reflection of political connections.
sick bastards,i will contribute to any who need vaccine money,furthermore,i will support peeps running for office who are pet friendly,open a twitter I DID@BAZZUUUU
I’d be very wary of Buffett as he’s basically pushing the Catfood/IMF line where he sets himself up as an example of “shared sacrifice” that will then be used as a weapon to go after Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security…in fact Buffett is being quite frank with this by going just short of saying “Raise my taxes a little so that you can attack the social safety net.” Buffett is trying to play the US role for what they’re doing in Italy with austerity where rich have their taxes go up while everyone else gets their social safety net cut as if it is an equal exchange.
Ugh. Sounds like a creep – for pushing his views on you like that. Maybe there’s a D mechanic out there who charges less!
smart cookie
Oh, yeah, that’s the kind of “fairness” they’re pushing.
follow me on twitter
@Bazzuuuu
KATIE O GRADY
HAPPY BIRTHDAY SOCIAL sECURITY!
I can relate to your story. I work a part-time job in customer service. The other day some random woman just started spouting off to me (as I was serving her) about the Stock Market, etc, and how she’s very frightened about losing all the money that she “… worked SO HARD for.”
I don’t doubt that she worked hard, and also don’t blame her for her concerns.
But then she launched into Rush Limbaugh’s talking point du jour, which was to *blame* everything wrong with the stock market on… you guessed it… POOR PEOPLE, who are lazy & ripping her off!!!
Dull witted supercilious, self-righteous, foolish people easily amused by authoritarian tribalism. Oh how fabulous to *blame* it all on faceless others – usually with different colored skin & weird (to them) religions – rather than looking for the real causes.
Most annoying… and I had to be gracious and polite bc it’s my job. I did my best to change the subject, esp bc she was venting to *everyone* and basically ranting. Too much hate radio!
Yep, that’s just what I thought when I read Buffet’s very disingenuous article this morning. Buffet has long proclaimed that the marginal tax rates should be raised, at least somewhat, so this is not all that out of character for him. He may even sort of mean it, but I suspect it is mainly at the expense of the middle/working classes losing some/part/all of OUR hard-earned Soc Sec & Medicare.
Don’t trust Buffet anymore than any other rich, greedy bastard. They all belong to the same clubs and scratch each others’ backs and look down on the triffling serfs, who are there for the sole purpose of being used, abused, chewed up & spat out.
Thanks for nothing, Warren.
Good examples, which readers of this post would be well-advised to commit to memory. Most citizens are clueless (not to be mean) about the difference between progressive & regressive taxes, and how the middle and working classes end up paying waaaaaaaaaay more in taxes – proportionately – than the super wealthy.
Bear it in mind the next time some conservative commences to whiiiing about how around 47% of citizens pay NO federal income taxes and how unfaaaaaiiiiir it all is, yadda yadda. Most citizens who don’t pay fed. inc. taxes are either: a) seniors/retirees on fixed incomes, b) students, and/or c) workers making such low wages that they’re really poverty stricken.
Conservatives like to make out that these “lucky duckies” (a verbatim quote from the WSJ) are a blight to the wealthy, but what conservatives consistently fail to mention are the very regressive state & local taxes, sales & use taxes, and FEES that everyone pays, no matter what. And these taxes/fees are disproportionately a much higher burden on the middle and working classes than for the super wealthy, for all the reasons that you cite.
Thanks.
Mr. Buffet forgot to say the following:
“Immediately, in order to raise the amount that I am willing to personally share, I will be doing the following:
1. I have fired all of my tax accountants and will be sending the money I used to pay them dircetly to the federal government.
2. I have removed ALL tax-advantaged investments from my portfolio. I am no longer going to invest in municipal bonds and the like.
3. I have decided on a fair % of my income to share with the government based on the average share paid by my employees, and I will automatically true up the amount I pay to the government so that it is above that %.
4. I have agreed that actions talk and bullshit walks, and from now on I will let my actions speak for themselves. I won’t ask for changes to tax law for others unless I have first proven my commitment to honoring those rules myself.”
heh… righteous rant. don’t hold your breath…
I’m not :)
I don’t like anyone (rich or poor, red or blue) talking about how to spend other people’s money when they are not willing to step up to the plate first. It would be a simple and relatively painless check for him to write, IF he believes so strongly in it.
I have never seen a line on my tax form saying “ONLY SEND IN THIS MUCH MONEY AND NO MORE”.
May I suggest that you stick your snide suggestion straight up your ass, and leave it there until it festers. I am beyond disgusted with sick, selfish, small-minded right-wingers who make the exact same remark and think it’s clever. I suppose you also thought it was clever to say, “Someone else go to war, and get blown to bits, so I won’t have to go.” Or, “Someone else recycle and refrain from littering, so I can continue to live like a selfish, uncaring pig who pollutes the Earth every day.” All equally clever. The bottom line always being,”Let someone else be responsible to the community that makes my life possible and enjoyable, so I can just take and take and take, and never give back anything, and never display any gratitude for the good life I have because I am ssurrounded by decent people who give a damn, while I do not care about anything but myself.” Sheesh!!! When someone, like Buffett, steps up to set a good example, the idea is that other good people will follow that example. He could donate his entire fortune and it would not make a dent all by itself. You know, just like you probably like to argue that removing the private jet subsidies won’t solve the whole problem.
Ol’ Buffy says his $8M tax bill is 17.4% of his income and scolds the government for not making him pay his “fair share”.
Try living on $45K. That’s most peoples “fair share”.
He’s a con man, implying that Congress cuts taxes on the rich on its own initiative, without lobbying by the rich for this result. Buffett is not believable with such an absurd claim …
The next time you argue with a Republican, take out a dollar bill and tell them that this is more than GE (14+ billion profit) and Exxon Mobile (30.9 Billion in profit) paid in income taxes on their Billions of profits AND I DO NOT THINK THAT IS FAIR. I would Never vote for a republican who would never vote to raise those corporate taxes.
Unless hedge fund managers eat 30 million calories a day, every day, a consumption tax is inherently unfair.
Buffet is an insider trader and in a sane world would be serving some jail time.
Maybe he was visited by the ghost of christmas present 2011? Maybe he writes these things when the fallout from his own conscience disrupts his otherwise exquisite slumber.
He’s no hero, rather, he is the perfect billionaire complement to someone like our President – words to soothe their conscience and ease the plebs’ fear all the while committing actions to despise.
Almost every billionaire is our enemy, wish it weren’t so.
I think you need some more qualifiers for that to be true.
I sent a suggestion in to have FDL start a fund that anyone can donate money into for future support for people who are really in need. If we are all in this together then it doesn’t matter who the money goes to. It could be an anonymous donation and someone from FDL distributes the money. Just a thought. There are a lot of members and lurkers on this site. I don’t think it would take a long time to start the fund. Food for thought.
You’re right. The tax rate for billionaires should go back to 91% like it was under Eisenhower.
Would you pay taxes if you did not have to, didn’t think so. Buffet knows he alone paying more taxes will not help. A consumption tax is regressive and is not revenue neutral.
Why should this be an either-or proposition?
Just as onitgoes said up at #31:
So you claim GE and Mobil paid “no taxes”. First you probably mean US Income Taxes. Your “profit” stats are not “US income” stats, but rather world wide. As onitgoes asks, how about state & local taxes, sales & use taxes, and FEES. I know for a fact that they pay 7.65% payroll tax for every US employee in the company for their portion of SS.
Will not help? I beg to differ. Warren’s behavior would be changed by having a a very high tax rate put on his gambling winnings.
While overall the amount coming in would be small compared to the costs of 6+ wars, I am just as concerned about the bad behavior of billionaires.
Tax the rich, don’t invent defenses for them, please and thank you very much. It’s quite a trick when they get us to be their human shields but sad indeed especially when it masquerades as folksy common sense, no offense.
Would you fight so hard for the poor and working poor that your ideological side is always whining pays no taxes? I think the f*ck not.
Hooray for alan1tx, muddying the frame with defense of a couple of the worst corporations.
If your allegiance is only to truth, maybe you could show that fight for the less fortunate? I welcome being proven wrong.
agreed
Come up with your own arguments, please, and don’t use mine in a kind of false flag move. I was talking about living breathing humans, not corporations. I disagree with you using MY arguments to *defend* corporations, who are sucking the life-blood out this nation. The fees or other taxes they pay are minimal at best, and in no way make up for all that they rip off of this nation, esp in terms of much impact the mega-corporations have on our environment, the use of valuable & limited resources, and the over-use of our failing & crumbling infrastructure, to name just a few things.
If you want to use “arguments” like that, then use YOUR own words, please. What you blurted out there has NOTHING to do with MY prior commentary.
Figure out your own thoughts please and do your own homework to support your assertions.
According to Forbes, Buffett is worth $50 billion (yeah that’s a ‘B’). If he’s so keen on redistribution of wealth, then give away $49 billion and I bet he could do a world of good. Something tells me he could get by on a billion $.
Until he does so, he can STFU about how everyone elses money is taxed, spent or other.
No.
You correctly pointed out that taxes are being paid even if they’re not paying federal income taxes.
True of poor people and true of GE.
You even pointed out that “everyone” pays those other taxes. That goes for corporations too. Don’t back away from your arguement, you were right.
So as it turns out, it’s you at #31 against Bobster33 at #38, and you’re arguing for Bobster33 against your own position?
Buffet has at long last figured out that there is not a lot more he can buy or control during his lifetime which will make himself substantially happier.
The most fortunate of us realized that somewhat earlier earlier in our lives. The sorriest cases never realize it at all.
I was going to point this out, but thought I’d read the other responses first. It surprised me to get through 44 of them before finding someone who had beat me to it.
David began here (and in his earlier post) with the over-simplification that raising tax rates ANYWHERE was counter-indicated right now. A bit later he did manage to understand that “the rich park their money rather than spending it”, but then apparently lost the significance of that before ending with the apparent conclusion that eliminating at least the higher-bracket tax cuts RIGHT NOW might limit any recovery.
Until such time as we’ve seen sufficient recovery that our idle production capacity gets used up and we need to encourage investment to create more, raising tax rates for the wealthy will have no effect whatsoever on any recovery (and therefore even the minor positive effect it might have compared to just borrowing or creating more money makes it desirable). The wealthy parlayed their wealth into additional income during the ’70s when top-bracket rates averaged 70%, during the ’60s when they averaged 80%, and during the ’50s when they averaged 90%, so they’re not about to be discouraged from such activities if the top-bracket rate is raised not only to its 39.6% Clinton-era level but up to at least 50% (the first step down from 70% that Reagan took).
So if we can afford to borrow (or create by fiat) $X, then we can raise an additional $Y by raising tax rates on the wealthy and use that additional revenue to create even more stimulus by distributing it to those most in need who WILL spend it immediately and thus create the normal multiplicative effect of that kind of stimulation (as contrasted with the kind created by tax cuts where such a large portion goes to those who will NOT spend it but just sit on it). A real no-brainer, at least from an economic viewpoint (unless, of course, your economics is of the voodoo variety).
To set the record striaght, I am not a member of the plutocrats.I am an average citizen who doesn’t begrudge those individuals that have worked hard for what they earn.This class envy group should shut their mouth up and go try to join the rich.The problem we have in this country is one of moral decay.David Cameron,the prime minister of the UK said it best.Children without fathers.Schools without discipline.Reward without effort.Crime without punishment.Rights without responsibilities.Communities without control.Some of the worst aspects of human nature tolerated,indulged-sometimes even incentivised by a state and its agencies that in past have become literally demoralized.The same thing that is happening in European socialist countries will happen in America.We have to quit creating programs that reward bad behavior because when you reward bad behavior you only get more bad behavior.Again,if Buffet wants to pay more taxes, there is DEPT G.Wealthy people pay most of the taxes and the government wastes the money rewarding bad behavior.
“No Regressive Taxation”. Make the politicians sign it.
Cashier at minimum wage pays 15.3% in Social Security taxes.
Wealthy pay 18% total according to Forbes.
Middle class pay 30-40% combined income tax and social security taxes.
Social Security taxes make up 40% of Federal revenue.
Make the wealthy pay at least as much as the middle classes.
The Democrats have only been arguing to raise the marginal tax rate back to 39% from 35%. That is not nearly enough to correct this situation.
Kassandra,I want to tell you what David Cameron,UK prime minister, had to say about the problems in the UK.He said the problem is moral decay of the culture.Children without fathers.Schools without discipline.Rewards without effort.Crime without punishment.Rights without responsiblities.Communities without control.Some of the worst aspects of human nature tolerated,indulged-sometimes even incentivised by a state and its agencies that in past have become literally demoralized.Its not Christian radio or Rush Limbaugh that has caused the problems in the UK or US but the moral decay of the culture and the rewarding of immoral behavior by government programs as cited by David Cameron.If more people listened to Christian radio, we might just be able to reduce some of the bad immoral behavior.Strongly suggest you keep your mechanic.
Rich leaches on society like David Cameron have pushed people into poverty, leaving them desperate with no hope. If people had jobs and decent incomes, there would be a lot fewer children without fathers. Rush Limbaugh is an ignorant asshole, there is no reason to like that turd. He preaches hate, and made a fortune doing it. Don’t even use ‘Rush Limbaugh’ and ‘Christian’ in the same sentence.
Get off my lawn!! You are ridiculous. Unless you are referring to the financial industry when you speak about reward without merit and rewarding bad behavior. If you are a regular person, and you are supporting the oligarchy and the status quo even now, then you are just self-destructive. So sad.
AND, why haven’t you joined the rich? Are you defective in some way, or just lazy?
‘Compassionate Conservative’ – lol. Just as bad as ‘Rush Limbaugh’ and ‘Christian’.
Yeah, this proves he’s being completely disingenuous about his comments on taxes. The elite class will never pay higher taxes under Obama, but we must cut the sh*t out of Medicare and Social Security.
I’m not rich financially because money doesn’t rule my life.But you don’t hear me complaining about what someone else has earned.I don’t think I’m entitled to what someone who decides to work 20 hours a day instead of 8 hours like myself.There are other things that are more important to me than just money but I dont cuss rich people for being rich.If you work 20 hours a day,I don’t think I or anyone else is entitled to 6 of your work hours to give us both 14 hours a day.It has nothing to do with being defective or lazy but just a different set of priorities.
Ah, but the wealthy do feel they are entitled to take from you what you earn. In America, the rich do the reverse Robin Hood – steal from the poor and give to the rich. Asking that they pay the same rate of taxation as the middle classes is never discussed in public. “End Regressive Taxation” – since the middle classes pay 30-40%, lets increase taxes on the wealthy from the 18% they are paying to 60%. Since they own 40% of all assets, they can well afford it, and our deficit problem goes away.
Responsible fathers have jobs and decent incomes,it is the irresponsible fathers that have no job or income.
I can see you just have no clue about what is really going on. Don’t worry. The awareness will come to you eventually.
You could take all the money from the rich in the country and you couldn’t pay off the debt.Let me give you an example of how much a trillion dollars represents.Lebron James makes 40 million a year playing basketball.In order for him to earn 1 trillion dollars, he would have to play in the NBA for 25,000 years.You read that right, 25,000 years.If you were educated in a public school,then I’m sure you couldn’t do the math.Don’t feel bad,neither can Geithner.
You don’t even know who the teams are. Geithner works for the oligarchs you are defending. We all know that here.
No, alces, you have been fed propaganda. 25% of all income goes to the upper 1%.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/eco_gro_nat_inc-economy-gross-national-income
Total national US income is around $10 Trillion yearly. $2.5 Trillion goes to the wealthy. Upping their tax rate from 18% to 60% brings in another 42% of 2.5 Trillion, or over $1 Trillion per year.
The wealthy lie all the time. Their propaganda tries to have it both ways. They say they already are paying all the tax – not true,they pay a lot of the income tax but none of the Social Security taxes. Then they say taxing them would make no difference, it would not raise any money. But it would.
I got straight A in Math all the way from grade school through engineering school.
I’ve been aware of what has been going on.In Feb.of 1985 the world debt reach the point where there is not enough resources in the world to pay off that debt.I’m prepared for what is coming but when it comes you and others like you will be caught with your pants down.The person who is in for a shock are people like you who are uninformed and truly clueless.
You proved my point with your stats.I said you could take the money from the rich and you couldn’t pay off the national debt.You say the wealthy get 2.5 trillion and our debt is over $14,599,534,941,715.85 as of Aug.16-01:04:02 AM GMT.Thank you for assisting me.As I said @68, you can take all the money from the wealthy and you can’t pay off the national debt.Again, you must have attended public schools.
Your making the assumption that the debt is paid in a one year time period.
Faulty calculation belongs to you.
Don’t worry about me. I’m counting on being Raptured up. /s
You are making faulty calculations.Even with the last compromise,7 trillion dollars will be added to the debt.We are now borrowing 41 cents of every dollar to run the government.My point to Matt was we don’t have a revenue problem as much as we have a spending problem.You keep attacking the wealthy and they will go other places.All of our green solar jobs have gone to China.The wealthy are leaving New York and California because of taxes and moving to Florida,Texas and other states.When the wealthy leave a state it causes debt problems and the same thing occurs when they leave the country.We don’t have a revenue problem that can be solved by killing the goose that laid the golden egg.Stop the damn spending.
I think before you get Raptured up, the government is going to Rupture you up.
No, I got the Word, I’m guaranteed a seat. I’m gonna get Raptured up, and you have to stay here and get taxed up the wazoo. Enjoy!!
No acles, we have a debt problem for three reasons. Clinton left a balanced budget. Tax cuts for the rich and corporations, unending wars that have cost trillions of dollars, and exporting jobs which leads to a loss of tax revenue. Ending the wars, and ending Regressive taxation, combined with providing incentives to return jobs to the US, is more than enough to lead to a budget surplus, which would allow us to pay off the debt over time. Entitlements for the wealthy and unending wars are the spending that is out of line. Leave our Social Security and Medicare alone.
Speaking of the big Rush, remember his viagra fueled vacation to Dominican Republic? A very wealthy man, he could have done like Eliot Spitzer, and used elite escort services. Now why would a wealthy man fly to DR for a sex vacation? I will give you three guesses.
Consumption Tax is one of the two primary reasons third world countries are stuck in third world status.
Since basic needs are same for every body, consumption too will be almost same for everybody and so Poor and Middle Class pay much more of the taxes in the tax pie and the country as a whole cannot come out of that poverty cycle.
I prefer a country where the rich live with prosperity and happiness around them which comes with progressive taxes rather than live with slums and depravity around them which comes with consumption taxes for the sake of progress of civilization and humanity.
It is not the consumption tax that has third world countries stuck in their third world country status, it is their form of government which is socialist or communistic in nature.If third world countries had a free market economy they wouldn’t be third world countries.I perfer a country where everyone has a chance to be the best they can be if they work hard and earn it themselves.In the case of the individuals who are poor through no fault of their own, that is what churches and charitable institutions take care of and help address the needs of the truly poor.Those who are poor through their own fault, you make uncomfortable in their poverty.
Most of the third world countries have more free market economy then we can imagine literally laissez faire economy with no government oversight. One of the reasons why they have poor quality of food and horrible drinking water, no access to proper higher education, no energy services etc.
BTW that is besides the point. Who is going to safe-guard the borders, who is going to pay for roads, who is going to pay for arbitration of disputes, who is going to safe-guard the wild lands we have safe-guarded for our children and grand-children to experience as we did, who is going to ensure we have a good quality of life with over-sight on all of our resources we consume like water, air etc. who is going to pay for cheap access to higher education, who is going to ensure our markets function properly if it relies on consumption tax which is like a horrible weapon to punish the wrong people.
That is precisely the reason third world living conditions are in slums with horrible air and water quality and the sad part is that they do not know one of the two primary conditions they are in is because of mother of all taxes i.e. regressive VAT taxes on them. They blame one another or their neighboring countries or whatever sounds fancy for the moment for their condition.
Charitable stuff is something very private and it depends on the individual, his subjective views of the world, his personal circumstances and his view of the future for himself and his family. Please do not count on that to flow always. Government is the only entity which can take money from all since it is an elected entity by people and because we all are equal stakeholders in them, to make sure above listed some of the above listed things it does out of the many others it does are done.